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I'll fix it.
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2,249 Posts
heh, the pic for the 851 is wrong, thats a testastretta engine, the 851 was a desmoquattro.


desmoquattro on left, testastretta on right:
 

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Can Afford To Be Critical
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1,852 Posts
I like the looks of the older one better.
Heads look similar to those on a Cosworth DFV - no coincidence.

Question: Harley Evo motor and NS500 racing engine from Honda but nothing from BMW? I would have thought the boxer twin would have been in there.
 

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Registered
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4,632 Posts
Interesting list...

One thing is certain, OctoFester can't really discredit it, it is in print after all, so it must be true......
 

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Panigaliscious
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9,103 Posts
Did the Corse 851's have a deep sump, or is that from a later version (748R? 916SPS?)
 

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V4 CyclePath...
Joined
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6,827 Posts
NSR Big Banger... the engine firing order courtesy the Big Bang RVF750 V4 4 stroke...

I predict someday all of the Gp bikes will be V4s... after all it sports the most
advantages in MotoGp... just as Rossi...

HONDA NSR500

Year: 1992

Horsepower: 168bhp @ 13,000rpm

Torque: 78ft.lb @ 11,450rpm

Layout: 498cc, two-stroke, 60-degree V-four

Honda’s NSR was the most successful of the 500cc two-stroke Grand Prix
missiles, and frequently the most scary too. That was mainly due to its V4
engine, which was generally the most powerful on the grid - and sometimes so
vicious that the world’s best riders couldn’t control it.

The NSR was debuted in 1984 by Freddie Spencer, who’d won Honda’s first
500cc title the previous year on the sweet-handling NS500 triple. The
liquid-cooled V4 was a much nastier device. It differed from Suzuki and
Yamaha’s V4s by having a single crankshaft, instead of twin contra-rotating
cranks. The reduced friction aided power: the first NSR’s 144bhp was purely
awesome in 1984.

Fast Freddie won the championship in 1985, and Wayne Gardner followed in
’87, by which time the V4’s breathing had been improved by increasing
cylinder angle from 90 to 112 degrees. Eddie Lawson regained the title for
Honda in ’89 - after the NSR’s evil-handling chassis had been reinforced in mid
season to cope with an engine by now producing 162bhp.

Honda’s V4 ruled the Nineties, with five titles for Mick Doohan plus one for
Alex Criville. Along the way it went to “big-bang” firing order (cylinders firing in
quick succession for added traction) then back to “screamer”. In 2000 even
Valentino Rossi couldn’t tame a NSR that had been tuned to make almost
200bhp. By the time Rossi took the final 500cc crown in 2001, the NSR had
won 130 GPs and ten world championships in 18 years. It was the most
dominant two-stroke Grand Prix engine ever created, made the MotoGP bikes
that replaced it seem utterly bland in comparison, and scarred a lot of brave
men in the process. To this day, the NSR500 engine is the maddest thing ever
made.
 

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Senior Member
Joined
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2,737 Posts
As uncle Fester hastily fires off several nastygrams to Visor Down with scanned crank drawings, pics of wheels with stars on them and air flow diagrams.
Aus45 pays the postage.
 

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Registered
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2,607 Posts
While I understand very well the reason they put the C90 engine in there (60 million satisfied customers cannot be wrong! :eek:) I would have gone for the CG125 engine. It's every bit as reliable as the C90 with the added bonus of a proper manual transmission and added grunt. And if it hasn't sold as much as the C90 it's not that far away.
I have long considered a CG125 or one of its derivatives (XL125, CBF125 etc) to nip down shops but Honda imported very limited numbers (following some dodgy gentleman's agreement with Piaggio) so finding one is harder than finding an exotica for sale and it's usually gone in a matter of hours.
 

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Registered
Joined
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651 Posts
NSR Big Banger... the engine firing order courtesy the Big Bang RVF750 V4 4 stroke...

Someday I predict all of the Gp bikes will be V4s... after all it sports the most
advantages in MotoGp... just as Rossi...

HONDA NSR500

Year: 1992

Horsepower: 168bhp @ 13,000rpm

Torque: 78ft.lb @ 11,450rpm

Layout: 498cc, two-stroke, 60-degree V-four

Honda’s NSR was the most successful of the 500cc two-stroke Grand Prix
missiles, and frequently the most scary too. That was mainly due to its V4
engine, which was generally the most powerful on the grid - and sometimes so
vicious that the world’s best riders couldn’t control it.

The NSR was debuted in 1984 by Freddie Spencer, who’d won Honda’s first
500cc title the previous year on the sweet-handling NS500 triple. The
liquid-cooled V4 was a much nastier device. It differed from Suzuki and
Yamaha’s V4s by having a single crankshaft, instead of twin contra-rotating
cranks. The reduced friction aided power: the first NSR’s 144bhp was purely
awesome in 1984.

Fast Freddie won the championship in 1985, and Wayne Gardner followed in
’87, by which time the V4’s breathing had been improved by increasing
cylinder angle from 90 to 112 degrees. Eddie Lawson regained the title for
Honda in ’89 - after the NSR’s evil-handling chassis had been reinforced in mid
season to cope with an engine by now producing 162bhp.

Honda’s V4 ruled the Nineties, with five titles for Mick Doohan plus one for
Alex Criville. Along the way it went to “big-bang” firing order (cylinders firing in
quick succession for added traction) then back to “screamer”. In 2000 even
Valentino Rossi couldn’t tame a NSR that had been tuned to make almost
200bhp. By the time Rossi took the final 500cc crown in 2001, the NSR had
won 130 GPs and ten world championships in 18 years. It was the most
dominant two-stroke Grand Prix engine ever created, made the MotoGP bikes
that replaced it seem utterly bland in comparison, and scarred a lot of brave
men in the process. To this day, the NSR500 engine is the maddest thing ever
made.
 

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Registered
Joined
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4,632 Posts
"NSR Big Banger... the engine firing order courtesy the Big Bang RVF750 V4 4 stroke... "

Wow, they really made a Big Bang RVF750? It mus have been top-secret because it was never shown in public. The only thing they showed in public was the screamer with the 360 degree crank.....

"Someday I predict all of the Gp bikes will be V4s..."

It's already happening, sort of. YOu just have to look at the back end of the grid, all the V4s are there......
 

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V4 CyclePath...
Joined
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6,827 Posts
Wow, they really made a Big Bang RVF750?
Yep... they really did thanks to Mick Doohan...

Developments of the 91 NSR 500 focused around Doohan testing a number
of designs as HRC shifted their main push behind the new up and
comer... For some while Doohan had been asking engineers to replicate
the wide power band characteristic of the RVF750 4 stroke
endurance big bang bike, which he and Gardner had used to lead the
previous summer's Suzuka 8 Hours... HRC answer was the 2 stroke equivalent of
the the 4 stroke Big Bang... technically speaking all four cylinders fried
within 70 degrees to afford the tire more time to hook up...

Superbike Planet 2010 Quote Jeremy Burgess on the Big Bang NSR...

A Well, the Big Bang wasn't only the Big Bang. It was a changing of
the porting of the bike, and some other issues that had been brought
in at the same time. Because in '96, we went back away from the Big
Bang. The Big Bang was a bike that gave you, towards the end, almost a
limit to ride that bike before it would do strange things. But it was
easy to push to that limit. The 180 engine was harder to ride, but
gave you more. You didn't get something for nothing. You had to ride
it harder. And it wasn't 'til '98 that the other blokes came onto that
bike. Criville and Okada couldn't ride it. Mick loved it. But the
cylinders were the same, everything was the same. And the head made
some improvement in the porting, when we went to the Big Bang. But it
certainly forced other manufacturers to go to the Big Bang.

Quote Bike:
Honda V-fours, both street and racing, have had both crank layouts.
But the flat drone of the RC30 RC45 made it unmistakably a 360 big banger.
That's principally why that V-four gem was renowned not so much for
its sheer power, but for being easy to set up and, above all, for its
ability to find grip out of turns.
 

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Registered
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200 Posts
Did the Corse 851's have a deep sump, or is that from a later version (748R? 916SPS?)
I think the bolt on deep sump was a corse only item and used much later than the 851. Shower injectors came later too.

+ 3 on the TZ750!

How about a top 10 race engine list?
 
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