Speedzilla Forums banner

1 - 20 of 43 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
651 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
At the 8th (of 18) race of the season, here is a recap of the current engine situation in MotoGP. We remind readers that each rider has a total of six engines available for the entire season, which works out to an average of three races per engine.

The morning before the German GP at the Sachsenring, Dorna released the list of engines sealed by each rider in the category. An examination reveals the varying approaches taken by each team and manufacturer.

Jorge Lorenzo, after suffering a spectacular and fiery engine failure during yesterday's qualifying session (it was his #2 engine which broke), is now using his 4th engine.

Dani Pedrosa has thus far used 3 motors. His #1 engine was used for 4 races, and his #2 and #3 have been used for two races each till now.

His teammate Andrea Dovizioso has also used three engines, his #1 and #2 being used for three races each.

Ducati rider Casey Stoner began using his 4th engine at Sachsenring. The problems with his #2 engine at Le Mans have caused issues for the rider and the team. His #1 engine lasted only one race, because of his crash in Qatar, and so the other two units have had to run 3 races each.

Valentino Rossi missed four races because of his injury: Mugello, Silverstone, Assen and Catalunya. His bike was still used for the last round though, the Catalan GP, by test rider Yoshikawa. The Japanese was using Valentino's #2 engine in the race. Rossi is now making use of his #3 engine for Sachsenring.

Three engines have also been used by Yamaha rider Ben Spies. The American's first two engines did two races each, and with the Sachsenring his #3 engine will have done four consecutive races.

Marco Simoncelli's engne use has been very consistent: he has thus far stayed on the three races per engine schedule, and so Sachsenring (race 8) will be run with his #3 sealed engine.

His Gresini teammate Marco Melandri is also on his third motor. His #1 engine did three races, his #2 engine two (as he skipped Assen with an injury), and the German GP will be the second race on his #3 engine.

The situation at Suzuki is quite critical. Loris Capirsossi was forced to begin using his #4 engine already at the fifth race, at Silverstone. His #2 engine had failed at Mugello, and his #1 engine failed in Barcellona, after having been used in only one race.

This brief analysis underscores the very real possibility of engine life playing a part in the World Championship.

The current MotoGP engine situation
 

·
He with the senior member
Joined
·
5,671 Posts
Yeah, it underscores the reality that overall performance in MotoGP and W/SBK is NEVER only about individual race performance or lap times. There is always a significant non-performance related factor that they have to consider and work within. In the recent past, it's been fuel consumption....where the engineers have had to balance fuel economy against performance. This is where Ducati shined for the last few years, with their most refined electronics package.

The Japanese caught up, but now we have the engine longevity restrictions.The job of the technical race engineer/design team is very, very much more complicated than simply building the fastest bike for the day. I think we all tend to forget these other restrictions, so thanks for the reminder...
 

·
V4 CyclePath...
Joined
·
6,827 Posts
True... it also underscores the basic engine architecture... the cube-like
crankcase of a V4 is indeed inherently more rigid than the longer, beam-like
case of an I4 engine. This will translate to reduced friction loss at higher
rpm-just what a company needs as a basis for an edge in longevity...

Quote Kevin Cameron:

"The past was no key to the future. Honda's 1960s GP bikes found power in
lots of small I4 cylinders, turning tremendous revs-but as revs rose, internal
friction took evermore of the power generated. Much of the loss came from
vibration,leading to parts misalignment. A new engine architecture was
needed-one naturally braced against vibratory forces."

"The natural alternative was a V-Four. Narrow and compact, it would also
have perfect primary balance, a great improvement over the buzzy,
second-order vibration of inline Fours. In testing, the cube-like crankcase of a
V-Four was indeed found to be inherently more rigid than the longer,
beam-like case of an inline engine. This translated to reduced friction loss at
higher rpm-just what the company needed as a basis for a new product line."
 

·
He with the senior member
Joined
·
5,671 Posts
zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

Care to take a bet on which is Championship winner for the 3rd consecutive year, Larry?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,632 Posts
zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

Care to take a bet on which is Championship winner for the 3rd consecutive year, Larry?
let's see, it couldn't be the V4 since it has only won once since the top class switched to four-strokes (and that was three years ago).... so much for its so-called superiority.... :p
 

·
He with the senior member
Joined
·
5,671 Posts
let's see, it couldn't be the V4 since it has only won once since the top class switched to four-strokes (and that was three years ago).... so much for its so-called superiority.... :p
Actualy, that'll be twice - 2006 and 2007 for riders championship
 

·
Is that Duke Red Enough?
Joined
·
308 Posts
8 races in and 10 to go and we've already seen Lorenzo lunch an engine Broadway style.

So much for the engine restrictions.

How many bikes will still be running at seasons end? And how many riders will survive the flying shrapnel and oil?
 

·
chimp on my shoulder
Joined
·
2,437 Posts
ahh, yes, picky picky! :)

I count them together. ;)
I like the guy and all, but I don't want credit given where not due. I would; however, like to see some old scans and drawings of the internals of a 211V.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,232 Posts
I've been waiting for this thread to start... Ugh.. V4, I4, Blah BLAH BLAH! It's about the damn RIDE.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
651 Posts
Discussion Starter #14
I love how Larry starts with a quote dating back to 1960 :clapper . He's in a wormhole way farther back than we ever thought.

Back to the topic, it may become interesting late in the season if teams have to dial back the horsepower and/or tell their riders to ride cautiously. We may see some winners who have never stepped on the podium.

I haven't decided whether I like this new rule or not.
 

·
V4 CyclePath...
Joined
·
6,827 Posts
zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

Care to take a bet on which is Championship winner for the 3rd consecutive year, Larry?
No bet Barry... I feel Yamaha's "virtual V4" should win its 3rd consecutive year...
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
914 Posts
Being a late comer to this party. How many of those motors were replaced because of them not working anymore and how many becuase they just were low on power? Does the rules say if you can use one of these older motors?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
651 Posts
Discussion Starter #17
Being a late comer to this party. How many of those motors were replaced because of them not working anymore and how many becuase they just were low on power? Does the rules say if you can use one of these older motors?
I believe the motors are sealed and stamped and the teams don't replace them unless there is something catastrophically wrong with them I would think. They are probably designed to last a certain number of races, and are not rebuildable.

Most are replaced from crashes and or failures, I don't think any team has replaced one because of it's lack of power...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
839 Posts
Being a late comer to this party. How many of those motors were replaced because of them not working anymore and how many becuase they just were low on power? Does the rules say if you can use one of these older motors?

I'm pretty sure there have been a couple of engines that have seen little to no usage after their initial session, so it's possible those were withdrawn due to lower power. Teams can use an engine until they unseal it and open it up, which you'd expect them to do with the old engines for the R&D.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
176 Posts
No bet Barry... I feel Yamaha's "virtual V4" should win its 3rd consecutive year...
How can it be a "virtual V4" if it still has the weak crankcase and high internal friction you noted in your quote? Looks to me that it's either an I4 or it's not. I, too, believe the Yamaha I4 will win the championship this year. :rockon
 
1 - 20 of 43 Posts
Top