Could the fire burn down WTC? - Speedzilla Motorcycle Message Forums
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post #1 of 39 (permalink) Old 09-07-2012, 09:26 PM Thread Starter
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Could the fire burn down WTC?


picture compare with Madrid fire
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post #2 of 39 (permalink) Old 09-08-2012, 02:19 AM
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Old news. Everything that can possibly be said on both sides of the coin, has already been said in just about every corner of the internet.

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post #3 of 39 (permalink) Old 09-08-2012, 04:26 AM
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Intense fire from the jet fuel did not melt the steel structure of the towers, but did heat it to a temperature where it was weak enough to buckle under the weight of all the floors above it. This would be a catastrophic event that would happen at once. One side of the structure would buckle near the impact/fire zone, and the other three corners would also buckle nearly simultaneously.

At this point the building's floors above the impact zone become a solid body, essentially a vertical wrecking ball weighing thousands of tons, which crushes the lower floors as gravity does its work.

It is no coincidence that the South Tower only took 50 minutes to collapse (despite the plane going in at an angle), while the North Tower took 90 minutes to collapse even though the plane hit the building square and caused massive structural damage. The South Tower was hit on floor 75, while the North Tower was 90 or so. The South tower had 15 more floors of building as dead weight on top, and its critical stress level as the temperature was raised from the fire was reached sooner.

This is just engineering. It was discussed literally within minutes of the first tower collapsing.




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post #4 of 39 (permalink) Old 09-08-2012, 04:50 AM
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Originally Posted by sburns2421 View Post
Intense fire from the jet fuel did not melt the steel structure of the towers, but did heat it to a temperature where it was weak enough to buckle under the weight of all the floors above it. This would be a catastrophic event that would happen at once. One side of the structure would buckle near the impact/fire zone, and the other three corners would also buckle nearly simultaneously.

At this point the building's floors above the impact zone become a solid body, essentially a vertical wrecking ball weighing thousands of tons, which crushes the lower floors as gravity does its work.

It is no coincidence that the South Tower only took 50 minutes to collapse (despite the plane going in at an angle), while the North Tower took 90 minutes to collapse even though the plane hit the building square and caused massive structural damage. The South Tower was hit on floor 75, while the North Tower was 90 or so. The South tower had 15 more floors of building as dead weight on top, and its critical stress level as the temperature was raised from the fire was reached sooner.

This is just engineering. It was discussed literally within minutes of the first tower collapsing.
As a person who works on military acft for a living, has done so for over twenty years, has seen an aircraft accident in person, has been part of several aircraft investigations, the majority of the public will not understand the effects of jet fuel, especially when mixed with whatever the additives called for, will do when burned. I've seen it, as it's burning and the after effects. It will burn like a mofo.I've seen it melt metal within minutes.

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post #5 of 39 (permalink) Old 09-08-2012, 04:57 AM
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IF any actual aircraft had hit the towers, these types of explanations might be plausible.
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post #6 of 39 (permalink) Old 09-08-2012, 01:37 PM
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post #7 of 39 (permalink) Old 09-08-2012, 06:13 PM
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post #8 of 39 (permalink) Old 09-09-2012, 01:31 AM
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Idiotic troofers
Morons who believe a crashing jet should punch a cartoon-like outline of itself into a reinforced concrete building.
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post #9 of 39 (permalink) Old 09-09-2012, 04:04 AM
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Originally Posted by KosmicRVTrider View Post
As a person who works on military acft for a living, has done so for over twenty years, has seen an aircraft accident in person, has been part of several aircraft investigations, the majority of the public will not understand the effects of jet fuel, especially when mixed with whatever the additives called for, will do when burned. I've seen it, as it's burning and the after effects. It will burn like a mofo.I've seen it melt metal within minutes.

Chris
The planes would have been filled with Jet A, which burns at something like 600-700F.

Steel may melt at roughly 2000-2500F (depending on alloy) but gets weaker at much lower temperatures. It's properties fall off drastically from 500-1000F. By 1000F you could consider it to be a very poor structural material.

I think we agree on this?




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post #10 of 39 (permalink) Old 09-09-2012, 06:51 AM
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Originally Posted by sburns2421 View Post
The planes would have been filled with Jet A, which burns at something like 600-700F.

Steel may melt at roughly 2000-2500F (depending on alloy) but gets weaker at much lower temperatures. It's properties fall off drastically from 500-1000F. By 1000F you could consider it to be a very poor structural material.

I think we agree on this?
100% we agree. I've seen what happens when jet fuel, JetA, JP4,JP8, etc is ignited and burns. I've seen it as the plane hits the ground and I've seen it after the fact,I don't know if the initial boom of the planes hitting the towers melted much or how much damage it did but the continual heat from that much jet fuel would damn sure weaken the metal. And it would weaken it a lot. I think that is the key. And it would have weaken the concrete also. Way to many internet engineers thinking this couldn't happen do not understand the dynamics of what happens when a jet full of fuel crashes.

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post #11 of 39 (permalink) Old 09-09-2012, 02:12 PM
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IF any actual aircraft had hit the towers, these types of explanations might be plausible.
...IF...

But... no aircraft.
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post #12 of 39 (permalink) Old 09-10-2012, 02:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WYD OPN View Post
IF any actual aircraft had hit the towers, these types of explanations might be plausible.

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Originally Posted by WYD OPN View Post
...IF...

But... no aircraft.
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post #13 of 39 (permalink) Old 09-10-2012, 04:46 AM
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Maybe there are planes in that water.

But I've seen extensive digital slo-mo analysis of lots of footage (much of which was subsequently destroyed); and the planes were CG. And not very convincing CG at that. In some shots, the undamaged nose of one of the planes emerges from the opposite side of the tower. In others, a plane instantly appears in a frame when the previous frame had no plane. In various footage, the planes are coming in at variable angles. One set of videos shows no background of New Jersy whatsoever; just a blank landscape.

There's a mountain of evidence. It's not just paranoid opinion. Others can believe what they've been duped to accept, and call it patriotism. I was part of a private research team that analyzed the data. Absolutely nothing lines up.

Agenda-phobes can cry conspiracy theory all they want.
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post #14 of 39 (permalink) Old 09-10-2012, 08:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WYD_OPN
I was part of a private research team that analyzed the data
Yeah right and now you are blabbing it all on the internet ... simply BS. Private research team of your mates, smoking sh!t.


What is it with Americans and conspiracy theories?

Mate planes fncken flew into those buildings. You can't hide a fully loaded plane with all those people on board, let alone 2. You cannot trick all those bystanders. Plus they have the other one that crashed thanks to brave passengers.

America would once again be a great nation if it's own people would stop kicking it in it's shins.
Pete
ps: And yes all the intelligent posts above about heat and metal yeld strength is what collapsed the towers. Just imagine the force when one floor collapsed. Remember the floor that collapsed was supporting many other floors.

And lastly, America and it's government did not need a reason to turn you all against terrorisim, you were rightly already there.

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post #15 of 39 (permalink) Old 09-10-2012, 11:50 AM
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Originally Posted by WYD OPN View Post
Maybe there are planes in that water.

But I've seen extensive digital slo-mo analysis of lots of footage (much of which was subsequently destroyed); and the planes were CG. And not very convincing CG at that. In some shots, the undamaged nose of one of the planes emerges from the opposite side of the tower. In others, a plane instantly appears in a frame when the previous frame had no plane. In various footage, the planes are coming in at variable angles. One set of videos shows no background of New Jersy whatsoever; just a blank landscape.

There's a mountain of evidence. It's not just paranoid opinion. Others can believe what they've been duped to accept, and call it patriotism. I was part of a private research team that analyzed the data. Absolutely nothing lines up.

Agenda-phobes can cry conspiracy theory all they want.
You are a lunatic with zero credibility.




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post #16 of 39 (permalink) Old 09-10-2012, 02:03 PM
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Originally Posted by WYD OPN View Post
Maybe there are planes in that water.
Agenda-phobes can cry conspiracy theory all they want.
isn't that exactly what your doing? you are either a complete idiot or your just trolling.
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post #17 of 39 (permalink) Old 09-10-2012, 03:24 PM
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Yeah right and now you are blabbing it all on the internet ... simply BS. Private research team of your mates, smoking sh!t.


What is it with Americans and conspiracy theories?

Mate planes fncken flew into those buildings. You can't hide a fully loaded plane with all those people on board, let alone 2. You cannot trick all those bystanders. Plus they have the other one that crashed thanks to brave passengers.

America would once again be a great nation if it's own people would stop kicking it in it's shins.
Pete
ps: And yes all the intelligent posts above about heat and metal yeld strength is what collapsed the towers. Just imagine the force when one floor collapsed. Remember the floor that collapsed was supporting many other floors.

And lastly, America and it's government did not need a reason to turn you all against terrorisim, you were rightly already there.
Backatcha, kiwi.
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post #18 of 39 (permalink) Old 09-10-2012, 03:25 PM
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You are a lunatic with zero credibility.
Backatcha, lunatic with zero credibility.
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post #19 of 39 (permalink) Old 09-10-2012, 03:29 PM
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isn't that exactly what your doing?
No.

Quote:
you are either a complete idiot or your just trolling.
Neither. Just logged in and saw this thread. Wanted to see how many idiots are out there who have been duped. Apparently a lot.

I didn't start the thread. I just responded to the naive posts.

Noboby said it was the gubbermint.
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post #20 of 39 (permalink) Old 09-10-2012, 03:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WYD OPN View Post


Wanted to see how many idiots are out there who have been duped.

Apparently a lot.

I didn't start the thread.

I just responded to the naive posts.

Noboby said it was the gubbermint.
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