If you work on your own bikes, do yourself a favor... - Speedzilla Motorcycle Message Forums
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post #1 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-29-2014, 03:10 PM Thread Starter
I'll fix it.
 
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If you work on your own bikes, do yourself a favor...

...and get some JIS screwdrivers.

If youve not heard of it before (dont worry, I hadnt until recently), JIS stands for "Japanese Industrial Standard", which has been around since 1916. JIS crosspoint screws are very similar to the phillips standard, but arent the same, and are still being used on Japanese bikes, as well as a lot of European ones.

The phillips standard was created in 1936, based on the JIS crosspoint, but designed to 'cam out' before maximum torque was reached. It was primarily meant to be used on assembly lines, where a broken or stuck fastener could mean stopping the line to repair, and at a time when metallurgy was nowhere near the level it is at today, so broken fasteners were much more common.

This perfectly explains why its so hard to unstick a screw with a phillips screwdriver, and one often has to resort to an impact driver. They just arent designed to transmit that much torque.

JIS screwdrivers fit the screw head much better than a phillips (and not just JIS screws, Ive found they work better on standard phillips screws as well). They are designed to let the user transmit as little or as much torque as they want to, without camming out. And I can speak from personal experience, they do just that.

This vid (while a little long and a bit boring) perfectly demonstrates this:

Cam Out Demo R - YouTube

I bought #1-3 sizes of the Vessel brand, and my high dollar Matcos now mostly collect dust. I ordered from RJRCOOLTOOLS but RRR Tool Solutions has more complete sets.
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post #2 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-29-2014, 06:44 PM
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I do need a set of those as I've buggered up so many of those jap Phillips screws in the past and present.


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post #3 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-29-2014, 06:54 PM
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They are popular on Japanese bikes with carbs.
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post #4 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-29-2014, 08:13 PM
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You don't need them on a BMW, since they use Torx on those!

Truth to be told this reminds me I should buy a replacement for one of a set of five much weathered screwdrivers I have (they are branded as Stanley and labelled as Made in Japan... just how old are those things?). I have misplaced one and cannot find it anymore...

Shame on me, my heart is black.
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post #5 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-29-2014, 11:42 PM
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wow, I've been fighting this for all these years...

...dawg
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post #6 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-30-2014, 11:42 AM
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I do work on my own bikes -- but the Hondas never seem to need anything other than fluid and tire changes. No crosspoint needed there.

cc
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post #7 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-30-2014, 12:21 PM Thread Starter
I'll fix it.
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ccolwell View Post
I do work on my own bikes -- but the Hondas never seem to need anything other than fluid and tire changes. No crosspoint needed there.
As someone who fixes Hondas for a living, I have to say: HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAA.


but seriously, youve never opened the airbox to check the filter? Never taken off the master cylinder lid to bleed the brakes? Checked coolant hose clamps? changed a windscreen? removed fairings? (honda just loves those little plastic push clips that require a crosspoint to pop loose)
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post #8 of 28 (permalink) Old 01-30-2014, 02:17 PM
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Torx

Quote:
Originally Posted by DesperateSP2 View Post
You don't need them on a BMW, since they use Torx on those!
Had to buy a full set of Torx drivers when I got the BMW K1300. I had a crappy set that worked well enough for the occasional use.
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post #9 of 28 (permalink) Old 02-03-2014, 03:48 AM
calculating status...
 
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I don't know, I just use with a 20oz ball peen on everything.


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post #10 of 28 (permalink) Old 02-03-2014, 06:43 AM
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I have a set and love them.
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post #11 of 28 (permalink) Old 02-03-2014, 02:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dezmo View Post
As someone who fixes Hondas for a living, I have to say: HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAA.


but seriously, youve never opened the airbox to check the filter? Never taken off the master cylinder lid to bleed the brakes? Checked coolant hose clamps? changed a windscreen? removed fairings? (honda just loves those little plastic push clips that require a crosspoint to pop loose)
I think they love those clips so much because they are the same things they use on their cars for bumper parts and other trim.
What always bugged me is the ones used on car never break. My Honda is 14 years old and I just popped a number of them loose to replace a couple blown bulbs with no issues.
On the SP each and every time I had to replace at least one because it broke... a true unfathomable mystery.

Shame on me, my heart is black.
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post #12 of 28 (permalink) Old 02-03-2014, 10:39 PM
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Never knew this....great info. I'll see if I can find a set of these....

Old Baldy
Triumph Tiger 955i with decent suspension.
Ducati 996 with hot 999 motor
Kawasaki KLR650

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post #13 of 28 (permalink) Old 02-07-2014, 07:11 PM Thread Starter
I'll fix it.
 
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you could say they grip the fastener well:


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post #14 of 28 (permalink) Old 02-07-2014, 07:35 PM
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What's the white powdery stuff on the work bench?!
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post #15 of 28 (permalink) Old 02-07-2014, 07:49 PM
Bemused
 
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I grabbed that three size set about a year ago after a recommendation in Motorcycle Consumer News, I love those things.
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post #16 of 28 (permalink) Old 02-07-2014, 10:33 PM Thread Starter
I'll fix it.
 
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Originally Posted by RAZR51 View Post
What's the white powdery stuff on the work bench?!
Just leftovers from jami's last visit...
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post #17 of 28 (permalink) Old 02-08-2014, 04:49 AM
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Just leftovers from jami's last visit...
You guys didn't spill the urn did you?

WW


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post #18 of 28 (permalink) Old 02-08-2014, 12:19 PM
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What is this 'airbox' thing you mention? Actually I di just get a set of these screwdrivers. I had looked for a set a few years ago but didn't find any. Thanks to Dezmo for the link.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dezmo View Post
As someone who fixes Hondas for a living, I have to say: HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAA.


but seriously, youve never opened the airbox to check the filter? Never taken off the master cylinder lid to bleed the brakes? Checked coolant hose clamps? changed a windscreen? removed fairings? (honda just loves those little plastic push clips that require a crosspoint to pop loose)

cc
1961 Clubman's Gold Star
2013 Daytona 675R (track bike)
2013 Duke 690
2014 Street Triple R
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post #19 of 28 (permalink) Old 02-08-2014, 02:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dezmo View Post
but seriously, youve never opened the airbox to check the filter?
Nope.


'00 RC51
'05 ST1300 streetfighter
'03 YZ85 supermoto
'90 VTR250
'71 T500R

Distant thunder, cold as stone. An RC bellows from its throne. One by one, each bike succumbs. Something wicked this way comes.

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Young butts can take the pain
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post #20 of 28 (permalink) Old 02-09-2014, 03:47 AM Thread Starter
I'll fix it.
 
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Nope.
did you think I was asking you, or were you just looking for a reason to post a blurry pic?
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