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post #81 of 206 (permalink) Old 11-27-2012, 10:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Waldo View Post
I have both a Mori box and Durbahn box I will send you if you are still offering the deal.

Sorry Dirk, that time has come & gone. Besides this new data that has come up has confirmed every dyno test I have done myself or seen from other tuners with closed airboxes or no airbox (pod filters) etc leading up to this an open airbox design. It is simply not what a stock RC51 engine needs.


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post #82 of 206 (permalink) Old 11-27-2012, 10:34 PM
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Sorry Dirk, that time has come & gone. Besides this new data that has come up has confirmed every dyno test I have done myself or seen from other tuners with closed airboxes or no airbox (pod filters) etc leading up to this an open airbox design. It is simply not what a stock RC51 engine needs.
Figured it could not hurt to try

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post #83 of 206 (permalink) Old 01-06-2013, 04:48 AM
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So back on track and back from the dead...

I ordered a Bazzaz and a Z-AFM tonight. Should be here in a week or so, but no reports 'till the spring when the UT thaws out. I'll update this thread as developments, uh... develop.

'00 RC51
'05 ST1300 streetfighter
'03 YZ85 supermoto
'90 VTR250
'71 T500R

Distant thunder, cold as stone. An RC bellows from its throne. One by one, each bike succumbs. Something wicked this way comes.

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Young butts can take the pain
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post #84 of 206 (permalink) Old 01-06-2013, 09:26 PM
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So back on track and back from the dead...

I ordered a Bazzaz and a Z-AFM tonight. Should be here in a week or so, but no reports 'till the spring when the UT thaws out. I'll update this thread as developments, uh... develop.

Awesome, Very much looking forward to your results!

I have to ask you "LRO" and everyone who reads this....Have you ever seen, heard of or tried one of these?


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As the price is very agreeable right eh!
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post #85 of 206 (permalink) Old 01-06-2013, 11:07 PM
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No, no, and no. Give it a shot and let us know how it works.

'00 RC51
'05 ST1300 streetfighter
'03 YZ85 supermoto
'90 VTR250
'71 T500R

Distant thunder, cold as stone. An RC bellows from its throne. One by one, each bike succumbs. Something wicked this way comes.

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Originally Posted by Old Baldy
Young butts can take the pain
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post #86 of 206 (permalink) Old 01-11-2013, 12:34 AM
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What now, motherbitches?


'00 RC51
'05 ST1300 streetfighter
'03 YZ85 supermoto
'90 VTR250
'71 T500R

Distant thunder, cold as stone. An RC bellows from its throne. One by one, each bike succumbs. Something wicked this way comes.

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Originally Posted by Old Baldy
Young butts can take the pain
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post #87 of 206 (permalink) Old 01-11-2013, 12:55 AM
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Sweet!

You mind me asking, How much for all of it?


Peace Jeff


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What now, motherbitches?

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post #88 of 206 (permalink) Old 01-11-2013, 01:44 AM
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You mind me asking, How much for all of it?
I've seen 'em for standard going rate on Ebay and what I have pictured would be somewhere around $610 through those means.

'00 RC51
'05 ST1300 streetfighter
'03 YZ85 supermoto
'90 VTR250
'71 T500R

Distant thunder, cold as stone. An RC bellows from its throne. One by one, each bike succumbs. Something wicked this way comes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Old Baldy
Young butts can take the pain
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post #89 of 206 (permalink) Old 01-12-2013, 03:26 AM
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I installed the Z-Fi and Z-AFM today, but am going to save cutting a hole and welding the bung on for the spring when I roll the bike out of my house.

The install was really quite straight forward and one of the easier Bazzaz's I've done. However, accessing the plug for the forward injector is a bitch with the T1 airbox.

This is the first twin I've installed one on, and discovered that on twin applications, you can adjust fuel trim on the individual cylinders. Since I also have a stand alone wide band O2/ 6 channel data logger (not the Z-AFM), I'll be adding bungs to the front and rear head pipes so I can fine tune each cylinder.

I'm looking forward to tuning this bike this summer. As you may remember from this past summer, I'm working on exhaust systems for these bikes, and the Bazzaz setup I have will allow me to compare my exhausts to the Moriwaki high mounts on my bike without having to pay $300+ for a dyno tune every time I swap cans.

'00 RC51
'05 ST1300 streetfighter
'03 YZ85 supermoto
'90 VTR250
'71 T500R

Distant thunder, cold as stone. An RC bellows from its throne. One by one, each bike succumbs. Something wicked this way comes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Old Baldy
Young butts can take the pain
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post #90 of 206 (permalink) Old 01-12-2013, 07:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Luck Runs Out... View Post
I installed the Z-Fi and Z-AFM today, but am going to save cutting a hole and welding the bung on for the spring when I roll the bike out of my house.

The install was really quite straight forward and one of the easier Bazzaz's I've done. However, accessing the plug for the forward injector is a bitch with the T1 airbox.

This is the first twin I've installed one on, and discovered that on twin applications, you can adjust fuel trim on the individual cylinders. Since I also have a stand alone wide band O2/ 6 channel data logger (not the Z-AFM), I'll be adding bungs to the front and rear head pipes so I can fine tune each cylinder.

I'm looking forward to tuning this bike this summer. As you may remember from this past summer, I'm working on exhaust systems for these bikes, and the Bazzaz setup I have will allow me to compare my exhausts to the Moriwaki high mounts on my bike without having to pay $300+ for a dyno tune every time I swap cans.

LRO AWESOME Man, friggin' Awesome!

I can't wait to see\hear your results with these pieces and If I may ask,.. Can you please post or I should say, can You, Start a New thread with what you're doing.... Everything from the beginning, Exhaust system, Headers, about the positioning\placement (with pictures?) of said sensors when you get them installed?

What Exhaust system(s) Headers:
Are you going to be running tests with OE Exhaust Header as well and or are You running a Full System, You're making your Own exhaust too right?
You thinking about doing your own Headers too?

Sorry for all the questions LRO, but, I can't help myself cause, IMHO this is really Very exciting EFI<>RC51 News!

Are you using a Power Commander now, have you "Mapped it-Dyno Graph?"
What if any engine or electronic mods.?

Okay, I'm done with All the questions

Peace Jeff
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post #91 of 206 (permalink) Old 01-12-2013, 09:06 PM
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Originally Posted by Luck Runs Out... View Post
I installed the Z-Fi and Z-AFM today, but am going to save cutting a hole and welding the bung on for the spring when I roll the bike out of my house.

The install was really quite straight forward and one of the easier Bazzaz's I've done. However, accessing the plug for the forward injector is a bitch with the T1 airbox.

This is the first twin I've installed one on, and discovered that on twin applications, you can adjust fuel trim on the individual cylinders. Since I also have a stand alone wide band O2/ 6 channel data logger (not the Z-AFM), I'll be adding bungs to the front and rear head pipes so I can fine tune each cylinder.
Didn't understand a word you said. What's this bazzaz thing suppose to do? I've never seen one before. Thanks.


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post #92 of 206 (permalink) Old 01-12-2013, 09:19 PM
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https://www.google.com/search?q=Bazz...w=1440&bih=739


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post #93 of 206 (permalink) Old 01-12-2013, 09:27 PM
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Lro, besides my other question, will you be detailing your install as well?


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post #94 of 206 (permalink) Old 01-12-2013, 10:34 PM
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Originally Posted by RVTMAVERICK View Post
Can you please post or I should say, can You, Start a New thread with what you're doing.... Everything from the beginning, Exhaust system, Headers, about the positioning\placement (with pictures?) of said sensors when you get them installed?
At some point, I will. For now, I've done a bit of talking about what I'm GOING to do, but don't have much to show for it, so I don't really see the need for another thread surrounding this. The good news is that my life has become significantly more fiscally stable in the past three months, so I foresee things developing at a faster rate than they have since May.

Quote:
What Exhaust system(s) Headers:
Are you going to be running tests with OE Exhaust Header as well and or are You running a Full System, You're making your Own exhaust too right?
You thinking about doing your own Headers too?
OE header is good for 145 WHP, and I'm expecting to be close to that, but not over, so I won't be building headers, nor will I bother with any full systems. The stuff I'll be building will be slip ons modeled after Sato lows and Moriwaki high mounts, for both SP1 and SP2 with stainless mids and a choice of five different cans and any length of can desired. I spent about 3000 miles testing some carbon cans on modded stock mids this past summer with good results. I want to put about 10K on them because I'll be offering a warranty beyond what most, if not all other systems come with. There's a thread on this in the FS section; you can search for it, or I'll dig it up and post the link.

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Sorry for all the questions LRO, but, I can't help myself cause, IMHO this is really Very exciting EFI<>RC51 News!
I'm excited as well because the Bazzaz is the tits.

Quote:
Are you using a Power Commander now, have you "Mapped it-Dyno Graph?"
What if any engine or electronic mods.?
I was using the PC3 USB. It's a good tuner for someone with mild mods, but I've got a bit more than just bolt ons, and wanted something more advanced than the PC. The main reason, however, is that the Bazzaz self- tunes (this has been talked about previously in this thread), and that is VERY advantageous for me, since it'll save me the cost of tuning my bike to every different exhaust prototype I build. I will do dyno runs to obtain HP data in comparison to the Moriwakis, so this is going to be a bit above and beyond the "other guys" making exhausts in their garages. Also, don't tell anyone I told you this, but there *might* be a slim chance of an underbelly exhaust like what the RC8 and Manigale has. If I can retain the original tuned length of the exhaust tract and make it fit under stock body work, consider it extremely likely. Anyway, that's all a bit off topic from the point of this thread- the Bazzaz.

Quote:
Okay, I'm done with All the questions
No, you're not.

'00 RC51
'05 ST1300 streetfighter
'03 YZ85 supermoto
'90 VTR250
'71 T500R

Distant thunder, cold as stone. An RC bellows from its throne. One by one, each bike succumbs. Something wicked this way comes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Old Baldy
Young butts can take the pain
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post #95 of 206 (permalink) Old 01-12-2013, 10:36 PM
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Didn't understand a word you said. What's this bazzaz thing suppose to do? I've never seen one before. Thanks.
Bazzaz is a fuel tuner. I'm fairly certain I'm the first one on 'Zilla with one for an RC51... Tip of the turd, right here, blazing new trails into the great unknown.

I'm assuming you're also asking about the WB O2 and 6 channel data logger? It's an older unit made by Innovate that I used to use to tune turbo cars back when boosting a Civic was a big deal. It's the LM-1 model, if you want to look up what it looks like, but basically, it's a wide band O2 sensor that logs up to 45 minutes worth of data that can be uploaded to a laptop to be analyzed. The six channels can be anything you desire- RPM, coolant temp, throttle position, manifold pressure, intake air temp, EGR duty cycle, ect... basically, it will record the exhaust gas oxygen content (the O2 sensor part), plus data from up to six other sensors on the engine. It gives you a very detailed look at what the engine is doing, when it's doing it, why it's doing it, and by knowing what you're looking at, you can determine the changes you need to make to the tune to fix the problems. With my RC51, I will be tapping into the RPM, manifold pressure (MAP sensor), coolant temp, intake air temp, and throttle position, as well as of course logging the O2. By doing this with each cylinder, I can utilize the ability of the Bazzaz to adjust the fuel to each cylinder individually. This will make the engine run smoother and make more power. If this still doesn't make sense, the general idea is that I'll be tuning the bike in the same manner that factory backed race teams did in the past, and that only a few private individuals may or may not have done. This is all possible because of the Bazzaz, and this is why I'm so excited that they finally released it for the RC51. This is cutting edge tuning technology and I feel it will open new doors as to what these bikes are capable of.

One last little footnote on the Innovate LM-1... because it can read the MAP sensor (and because all Honda MAP sensors will read up to 11 PSI above atmospheric conditions), I'll be able to see exactly how much positive pressure is created at speed due to the ram air effect inside the airbox. That's useless data in the scheme of things here, but it'll be interesting to see just how much "boost" is created at 100- 160 MPH.

'00 RC51
'05 ST1300 streetfighter
'03 YZ85 supermoto
'90 VTR250
'71 T500R

Distant thunder, cold as stone. An RC bellows from its throne. One by one, each bike succumbs. Something wicked this way comes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Old Baldy
Young butts can take the pain
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Last edited by Luck Runs Out...; 01-12-2013 at 11:03 PM.
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post #96 of 206 (permalink) Old 01-12-2013, 10:43 PM
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Lro, besides my other question, will you be detailing your install as well?
I won't be detailing the install of the Bazzaz at all because it went in exactly as the instructions said and took about an hour (only because the tank was already off). However, I will detail how it's different than the Power Commander.

PC: Plugs in line between the main harness and the TB harness at the big grey plug that's located to the left of the rear TB, under the airbox and requires a ground. That's it.

Bazzaz Z-Fi: Plugs in line with each individual injector and the crank position sensor, requires a ground and a switched 12V+ signal, and taps into a wire on the TPS and neutral switch.

The Z-AFM is straight forward: It plugs into a plug on the Z-Fi harness, and then a hole is drilled in the header at the collector and a bung is welded on so that the O2 sensor can be screwed in.

'00 RC51
'05 ST1300 streetfighter
'03 YZ85 supermoto
'90 VTR250
'71 T500R

Distant thunder, cold as stone. An RC bellows from its throne. One by one, each bike succumbs. Something wicked this way comes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Old Baldy
Young butts can take the pain
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post #97 of 206 (permalink) Old 01-12-2013, 10:57 PM
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What are you doing to get 140+ rwhp?


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post #98 of 206 (permalink) Old 01-12-2013, 11:15 PM
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What are you doing to get 140+ rwhp?
Airbox, ported heads, 12:1's, SP2 TB's, soft rev and PAIR delete, exhaust. I dunno where it will actually end up, but those that have been down the road have said it'll be close to 145. The tune I paid for on the PC3 sucked a big one, so until I get it tuned by the Bazzaz and see HP/ TQ printed on paper, I don't expect anything more than stock. FWIW, with the shit tune, it still stayed within two bike lengths of an '09 1000RR 'till about 140 MPH. And yes, we swapped bikes; same results.

'00 RC51
'05 ST1300 streetfighter
'03 YZ85 supermoto
'90 VTR250
'71 T500R

Distant thunder, cold as stone. An RC bellows from its throne. One by one, each bike succumbs. Something wicked this way comes.

Quote:
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Young butts can take the pain
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post #99 of 206 (permalink) Old 01-12-2013, 11:24 PM
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Generally I've seen around 135 with those mods, but I'll definitely be interested to see your results. That's impressive when you consider the 30hp/30lbs difference between the two bikes. I have my Bazzaz AFM setup, but haven't really had the weather to get the map right. Should make between 165-170, but I'm not too worried about it as long as it feels good.


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post #100 of 206 (permalink) Old 01-12-2013, 11:34 PM
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Agreed on being surprised by the results. Maybe his bike was sick, or I build meaty engines. Either way, swapping bikes and having multiple goes from 15 MPH with the clutches all the way out and seeing the same results told us it wasn't a fluke. Don't get me wrong- his bike was still faster than mine, no matter what, but my bike did have his off the line 'till about 40 MPH, then his bike reeled mine in, passed it at about 90, and was about two bike lengths ahead by 140. I suspect that with the better Bazzaz tune, the difference will be much less. Then again, until a dyno plot has been produced, this is all bullshit. And you're right- it's all about area under the curve and not peak figures.

'00 RC51
'05 ST1300 streetfighter
'03 YZ85 supermoto
'90 VTR250
'71 T500R

Distant thunder, cold as stone. An RC bellows from its throne. One by one, each bike succumbs. Something wicked this way comes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Old Baldy
Young butts can take the pain
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