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post #1 of 261 (permalink) Old 07-07-2011, 04:03 PM Thread Starter
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Operation fast and furious

Eric Holder, Eric Holder Eric Holder.... Should he be indicted? Is there a cover-up? Are ATF agents being muzzled? Is Justice in a CYA mode? Was there a plan by Obama to shift the blame of US weapons going into Mexico on American gun laws? The big question is why would JD let this happen? What would they gain? There was no way to track the weapons once in Mexico. Very strange...
CBS News has learned that House and Senate investigators have descended upon Arizona for their probe into the so-called "Gunwalker" scandal. They're gathering interviews from witnesses, including ATF insiders and area gun shop owners. Sources tell CBS News the congressional investigators are frustrated by what they view as across-the-board stonewalling by government agencies which have refused to provide information in the investigation. Government officials have said they won't provide information while their own investigations are ongoing.

"They're investigating themselves," says one source on Capitol Hill, "and then claiming the open investigations preclude them from giving Congress information it needs for independent oversight. It's highly improper."
The Arizona connection:
Attkisson's report also identifies the Assistant U.S. Attorney who advised Operation Fast and Furious as AUSA Emory Hurley. Mr. Hurley's boss U.S. Attorney Dennis Burke was the long-time chief of staff for Secretary of Homeland Security Janet Napolitano. As a reminder, one should not forget that Napolitano was the Governor of Arizona until she assumed the DHS post in 2009.

Congressional investigators are in Arizona tracking down information in the on-going “Project Gunrunner” investigation, and according to CBS News, one of the key figures involved in the Phoenix-based “Fast and Furious” segment of the gun running sting may provide a link to Homeland Security Chief Janet Napolitano. CBS News is reporting this afternoon that the prosecutor in the U.S. Attorney’s office in Phoenix who advised the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives on “Fast and Furious was Emory Hurley. He answers to U.S. Attorney Dennis Burke, who formerly served as chief of staff for then-Gov. Napolitano. Independent blogger Mike Vanderboegh, who dug up the Gunrunner story with National Gun Rights Examiner David Codrea almost five months ago, is also commenting on this new development here.

In a related development, Attkisson reports that George Gillett continues to spill the beans to Sen. Charles Grassley's staff. As I emphasized earlier in the month, this is the equivalent of a Nixon White House insider giving the goods to Sen. Sam Ervin's Watergate investigation.

The Justice Department is obstructing the congressional investigation of a U.S. law enforcement operation intended to crack down on major weapons traffickers on the Southwest border, according to the embattled leader of the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives.

Read more at the Washington Examiner: Operation Fast and Furious should end Holder tenure | Examiner Editorial | Opinion | Washington Examiner

Watergate cliches though they are, two questions beg to be asked about the exploding Fast and Furious scandal at the U.S. Department of Justice: What did Attorney General Eric Holder know and when did he know it concerning the underlying concept, operational protocols and legal status of the Operation Fast and Furious program in the Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms bureau?

The left: June 28, 2011. Media Matters has documented the growing trend of Fox News and other conservative media outlets pushing the baseless conspiracy theory that the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms, Explosives (ATF) Fast and Furious program was an intentional covert plan to push gun control laws.
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post #2 of 261 (permalink) Old 07-07-2011, 05:30 PM
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We should take serious steps to flog Eric Holder and the information against him and his agency is beginning to come out despite the stone wall approach he's taken against the Congressional hearing.

Looks like their planned fall guy isn't going with the program.

Sipsey Street Irregulars: Melson officially off the Gunwalker reservation. Text of Grassley/Issa Letter to the Arch-criminal Holder.

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post #3 of 261 (permalink) Old 07-07-2011, 05:57 PM Thread Starter
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This is going to be big...way beyond belief!
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post #4 of 261 (permalink) Old 07-07-2011, 06:35 PM
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Hopefully big enough to cause Obama some election headaches and enough to land Holder onto the unemployment line.

Something has to be done about the shooting death of the Border Patrol Agent because of this stupid operation.

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post #5 of 261 (permalink) Old 07-07-2011, 07:10 PM Thread Starter
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Mexican officials want Fast & Furious officials extradited for trial

Video: Mexican officials want Fast & Furious officials extradited for trial Hot Air
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post #6 of 261 (permalink) Old 07-07-2011, 07:31 PM Thread Starter
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How many times has this happened?

Guns Sold in Secret U.S. Operation Used in Cartel Murder



YouTube - ‪Guns Sold in Secret U.S. Operation Used in Cartel Murder‬‏
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post #7 of 261 (permalink) Old 07-08-2011, 11:53 PM Thread Starter
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Los Zetas kingpin says:

Your not going to believe this...

However, according to the testimony of Rejón Aguilar, one of the original seven members of Los Zetas who was recently captured by police, in some cases Mexican drug gangs did not have to wait until the firearms reached the border – they purchased guns directly from the US government itself inside America.

Los Zetas Kingpin: We Bought Guns Directly From U.S. Government Alex Jones' Infowars: There's a war on for your mind!
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post #8 of 261 (permalink) Old 07-09-2011, 05:06 PM Thread Starter
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43 weapons in Phoenix traffic stop linked to ATF strategy

The strategy was designed to lead ATF officials to key drug players in Mexico, but some agents admitted they never fully tracked the weapons after suspicious buyers purchased them.


“It made no sense to us either, it was just what we were ordered to do, and every time we questioned that order there was punitive action,” Phoenix Special Agent John Dodson testified.

43 weapons in Phoenix traffic stop linked to ATF strategy

The Plan ^ the result > President Obama to address gun control soon, aides say
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post #9 of 261 (permalink) Old 07-11-2011, 05:10 PM
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Why didn't they install GPS locators in the guns?
Because they didn't know which stores the buyers would use?

Why did the operation go on so long with so many weapons unaccounted for?

Who ordered the operation?

The number of purchases only goes to prove that before operation fast and furious there already was established gun running from US stores to Mexico. What percentage are the guns sold under fast and furious of the total guns over, say, the last five and ten years?

Lots of questions. Looking for answers on this one.

The usual (hopeful) accusations against Obama again call for more salt. Reminds me of Sestak...again. Keep digging for dirt, boys. Maybe one day you'll find some. The accusation that the operation was somehow intended to provide cause for more gun control is...I don't know...hard to come up with a word that describes that level of suspicion. Paranoia doesn't quite cover it. Does this mean that gun nuts are also beyond paranoid?

"...let us not ignore the truth among ourselves, that we are the aggressors and they defend themselves. The country is theirs, because they inhabit it, whereas we want to come here and settle down."
David Ben-Gurion (the father of Israel)
"When fascism comes to America it will be draped in a flag and holding a cross." Sinclair Lewis
I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, and to the republic for which it stands. One nation, indivisible, with liberty, and justice for all.
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post #10 of 261 (permalink) Old 07-11-2011, 05:32 PM
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Why didn't they install GPS locators in the guns?
Because they didn't know which stores the buyers would use?

Why did the operation go on so long with so many weapons unaccounted for?

Who ordered the operation?

The number of purchases only goes to prove that before operation fast and furious there already was established gun running from US stores to Mexico. What percentage are the guns sold under fast and furious of the total guns over, say, the last five and ten years?

Lots of questions. Looking for answers on this one.

The usual (hopeful) accusations against Obama again call for more salt. Reminds me of Sestak...again. Keep digging for dirt, boys. Maybe one day you'll find some. The accusation that the operation was somehow intended to provide cause for more gun control is...I don't know...hard to come up with a word that describes that level of suspicion. Paranoia doesn't quite cover it. Does this mean that gun nuts are also beyond paranoid?
All it means is that people like yourself are beyond stupid. You can't even understand the basic problems with an agency like Justice being led by a buffoon. That's what is killing the country folks, dumb voters.

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post #11 of 261 (permalink) Old 07-11-2011, 07:16 PM
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All it means is that people like yourself are beyond stupid. You can't even understand the basic problems with an agency like Justice being led by a buffoon. That's what is killing the country folks, dumb voters.
You're a good example of why this place sucks. You remind me of Charles Krauthammer. No matter what the story, no matter what the facts, everyone knows where you're going before it ever happens.

"...let us not ignore the truth among ourselves, that we are the aggressors and they defend themselves. The country is theirs, because they inhabit it, whereas we want to come here and settle down."
David Ben-Gurion (the father of Israel)
"When fascism comes to America it will be draped in a flag and holding a cross." Sinclair Lewis
I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, and to the republic for which it stands. One nation, indivisible, with liberty, and justice for all.
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post #12 of 261 (permalink) Old 07-11-2011, 08:08 PM Thread Starter
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Why didn't they install GPS locators in the guns?
Because they didn't know which stores the buyers would use?
Stop right there... Is that a question or the answer for the second sentence?
Sounds like you answered your own question. The whole premise is flawed.

If ATF couldn't track the weapons (which they couldn't) and the field agents complained about that fact and were reprimanded... kind of makes me think that tracking the weapons was never the objective.

Now go back and read nycstripes reply to your post. Makes more sense now doesn't it.
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post #13 of 261 (permalink) Old 07-11-2011, 08:49 PM
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You're a good example of why this place sucks. You remind me of Charles Krauthammer. No matter what the story, no matter what the facts, everyone knows where you're going before it ever happens.
If you didn't have your head so firmly up your own ass, you would be able to follow logic from time to time. Don't be pissed at me for simply pointing this out, we've been telling you for years. You just can't hear us.

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post #14 of 261 (permalink) Old 07-11-2011, 11:06 PM
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Stop right there... Is that a question or the answer for the second sentence?
Sounds like you answered your own question. The whole premise is flawed.

If ATF couldn't track the weapons (which they couldn't) and the field agents complained about that fact and were reprimanded... kind of makes me think that tracking the weapons was never the objective.

Now go back and read nycstripesreply to your post. Makes more sense now doesn't it.
Wutsa mattuh, don't understand this:
?

I can think of a few things that are flawed around here and my post isn't one of them.


And yeah, it doesn't sound like tracking was the objective. More like, lets see how many are sold and where will they show up. Sounds like a stupid ****ing operation if you ask me. But I don't think it made any difference in the number of guns they have. There are countless number of low-lifes in the gun trade, legal or illegal, where they get what they need. It's probably easier and safer to buy kill toys (for sick, twisted ****s) in a US gun store than on the black market, thanks to the NRA.

"...let us not ignore the truth among ourselves, that we are the aggressors and they defend themselves. The country is theirs, because they inhabit it, whereas we want to come here and settle down."
David Ben-Gurion (the father of Israel)
"When fascism comes to America it will be draped in a flag and holding a cross." Sinclair Lewis
I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, and to the republic for which it stands. One nation, indivisible, with liberty, and justice for all.
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post #15 of 261 (permalink) Old 07-12-2011, 04:20 AM Thread Starter
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CYA Mode

Feds expand gun sales reporting requirements in four border states - CNN.com
Only in a Marxist society... I mean this Administration can do this:^

Anybody ever hear of a little thing called
the Firearm Owners Protection Act of 1986 (FOPA)

From what I understand from the gun dealers here in Arizona. They had (concerns) an understatement on the transaction taking place to straw buyers at their stores. After contacting the ATF they were told to keep selling as this was part of an on going investigation by the Federal government. Being the skeptics that are they had lawyers draft a document that was sent to Congress as proof so that they could not be double crossed by the Feds.

Remember the setup by Obama and Hillary Clinton touting how guns bought in the United States and ending up in Mexico. Little did we know that it was our own government who was involved in the dealing.

THIS JUST MAY TAKE OBAMA/HOLDER DOWN!! A LOT TO READ, BUT WORTH IT!! - Rainy Day Patriots
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post #16 of 261 (permalink) Old 07-12-2011, 03:21 PM
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You're a good example of why this place sucks. You remind me of Charles Krauthammer. No matter what the story, no matter what the facts, everyone knows where you're going before it ever happens.
obombus/holder have a firearms adgenda, if you dan't see that, I have nothing else for ya......

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post #17 of 261 (permalink) Old 07-12-2011, 09:12 PM
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obombus/holder have a firearms adgenda, if you dan't see that, I have nothing else for ya......

Semper Fi!

-Rocky-
Anyone with a fully functioning brain has a firearms agenda because gun deaths are one of this countries great failings. But hey, a lot of Mexicans are employed in the gun industry so I guess it's all worth it.


Gun Deaths - Gun Deaths

"...let us not ignore the truth among ourselves, that we are the aggressors and they defend themselves. The country is theirs, because they inhabit it, whereas we want to come here and settle down."
David Ben-Gurion (the father of Israel)
"When fascism comes to America it will be draped in a flag and holding a cross." Sinclair Lewis
I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, and to the republic for which it stands. One nation, indivisible, with liberty, and justice for all.
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post #18 of 261 (permalink) Old 07-12-2011, 11:04 PM
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I have an issue with a violence survey conducted by the CDC. Another f'd up US government bureaucracy that has nothing better to do than delve into issues best left to the FBI or other law enforcement entity. Its a waste of time and resourses to duplicate this with a political slant. Its just like the waste of money with the Dept of Agriculture originating home loans.....

Here's something from that so called study called for that absolutely has never come to pass....(thankfully).

"Health officials believe that guns in the U.S.could become the leading cause of death attributed to injury by the year 2003, surpassing injuries due to motor vehicle crashes."

(Injury Mortality Reports).
Using the CDC Database this was far from correct.

I'd like to see data that takes into account the inner city gang violence that is taking this country by storm. Targeted immigration which allows an almost free-flow immigration from 3rd world countries plagued by violent criminals is definitely having a negative effect on our personal safety.

I say that these statistics support a reason for law abiding citizens to be allowed to protect themselves from the animals that roam the streets. The police cannot be there 100% of the time and the gun deaths prove that this is so. When guns are outlawed, only outlaws will have guns.


2003 - 2004, United States
Homicide Firearm Deaths and Rates per 100,000
All Races, Both Sexes, All Ages

Deaths Population
23,544 583,372,157

2003 - 2004, United States
Overall Motor Vehicle Deaths and Rates per 100,000
All Races, Both Sexes, All Ages

Number of
Deaths Population
90,042 583,372,157

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post #19 of 261 (permalink) Old 07-13-2011, 01:40 AM Thread Starter
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Anyone with a fully functioning brain has a firearms agenda because gun deaths are one of this countries great failings. But hey, a lot of Mexicans are employed in the gun industry so I guess it's all worth it.
I thought SUV's deaths are one of this countries great failings (SUV's killing rise as gas prices drop) That's a fact!.

Also I did the research and if everybody drove a Prius, Mexicans would have a hard time getting to work in the gun industry. (so it might be worth it?)

Your a Fvcking idiot.
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post #20 of 261 (permalink) Old 07-13-2011, 02:05 AM
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Originally Posted by Iceman_JD View Post
I thought SUV's deaths are one of this countries great failings (SUV's killing rise as gas prices drop) That's a fact!.

Also I did the research and if everybody drove a Prius, Mexicans would have a hard time getting to work in the gun industry. (so it might be worth it?)

Your a Fvcking idiot.
Actually, testicle head (that is what you'd like to be called, isn't it?), SUV's are now one of the safest vehicles on the road due to pressure put on the industry to improve their stability. So maybe one of you family-of-four friends will find themselves alive the next time they have to take evasive manuevers. You see, son, statistics are used to improve life, not just to take your toys or manhood (or whatever it is to you).

You fellas crack me up - so assbackwards it's like you want to go back in time. So much to fear in life. So much to whine about. So little wisdom.

"...let us not ignore the truth among ourselves, that we are the aggressors and they defend themselves. The country is theirs, because they inhabit it, whereas we want to come here and settle down."
David Ben-Gurion (the father of Israel)
"When fascism comes to America it will be draped in a flag and holding a cross." Sinclair Lewis
I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, and to the republic for which it stands. One nation, indivisible, with liberty, and justice for all.
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