Massive Muslim immigration will be one of the downfalls of Europe

[Old Fart]

Having traveled in the mid east quite extensively I can say that nobody likes or wants the Palastinians. As a part of past and ongoing meetings in the region, the humanitarians, big stick nations, or appointed peace keepers invariably create less than popular legislation. The edict is typically to create and provide housing for the Palis.

So what does the hosting country do? Well to drive their insulting point home yet to comply, they build relatively low cost sub standard housing. But as an eff you, often the sewage pipes don't connect to the sewers but discharge at the street. 'Oh we'll connect it, but the price is $$$$ which the Palis can't afford. Take that you Pali infidel. Or, 'Oh I'm sorry, the electrical wires don't reach to your area'. Or 'gee, sorry, the power goes off in the morning and evening'. 'Nope, sorry, the water pipes don't reach'.

Not a pleasant area to walk or drive through as turds are floating down the gutter with the associated stench. Nothing will change. Immigration is often a condition that induces problems on many levels.

[Area 51]

Originally Posted by twin-nut

If the Palestineans cannot control their own militants than their will never be peace. Period. It is not up to Israel to police them because they only provoke more anger when they crack down too hard which has been often. Chinese and Iranians cannot even hold peaceful demonstrations without the serious threat of retribution(less so in China now obviously). I don't think the US or Germany should send one dime to Israel ever again. If they cannot broker peace than we should let them go it alone. The Palestinean leaders have so often turned a blind eye to the militants that their is little hope for any real peace in my opinion. This is a prime example of why religion is harmful around the world.

At least if Obama continues to fail and show weaknness to Iran, Israel might in dramatic fashion take care of the situation.

Some good points there but there are also, IMO, two basic misunderstandings of the situation. One, Israel cannot take care of Iran. Almost all experts believe that even the U.S. could not take out the Iranian nuke program since they are so far under ground and also since one of the sites is right next to yet another one of those ridiculous sites of religious significance. Two, Why should the Palestinians "control" their militants even if they could, which they cannot? Zionists started this mess and they continue it, and they will continue it no matter what agreements are brokered. The only thing they care about is a bigger and stronger Israel, period. The Palestinians are weak so they have, are, and will continue loosing thier land and homes to the invaders. Fighting back with ineffective small bombs, etc. is the only recourse. Look what happened when the American indians negotiated with the U.S. The same thing will happen to the Palestinians, only worse. It seems no matter how advanced humans become the strong still take from the weak. We can sugar coat it all we want, with all our technology and art and democracy, etc. but we are still barbarians, and that's double true in the Holy Land .

[robfromsc]

Originally Posted by Area 51

Some good points there but there are also, IMO, two basic misunderstandings of the situation. One, Israel cannot take care of Iran. Almost all experts believe that even the U.S. could not take out the Iranian nuke program since they are so far under ground and also since one of the sites is right next to yet another .

Do ya remember the "rocket" we fired off at the moon a few weeks back? Can you say bunker buster?

[mrgrn]

Originally Posted by Area 51

Some good points there but there are also, IMO, two basic misunderstandings of the situation. One, Israel cannot take care of Iran. Almost all experts believe that even the U.S. could not take out the Iranian nuke program since they are so far under ground and also since one of the sites is right next to yet another one of those ridiculous sites of religious significance. Two, Why should the Palestinians "control" their militants even if they could, which they cannot? Zionists started this mess and they continue it, and they will continue it no matter what agreements are brokered. The only thing they care about is a bigger and stronger Israel, period. The Palestinians are weak so they have, are, and will continue loosing thier land and homes to the invaders. Fighting back with ineffective small bombs, etc. is the only recourse. Look what happened when the American indians negotiated with the U.S. The same thing will happen to the Palestinians, only worse. It seems no matter how advanced humans become the strong still take from the weak. We can sugar coat it all we want, with all our technology and art and democracy, etc. but we are still barbarians, and that's double true in the Holy Land .

". Look what happened when the American indians negotiated with the U.S. The same thing will happen to the Palestinians, only worse."

and we american sleep at night after giving them blankets with germs they could not fight off to kill them while blathering on about muslims taking over

[twin-nut]

If the crap really hit the fan with Iran, Israel could take care of the situation. A fission bomb has thee advantage of both huge blast effect and electromagnetic pulse and couldd leave enouggh radiation to prevent anyone from easily going back in that deep bunker. Although because the world community would raise holy hell, and rightfully so, it would take a serious perceived threat on the Israelis paart, but I am not sure they are willing to wait until Iran has a nuclear weapon completed. Obvious conjecture.

Is it not ironic that so much of the world is just beginning their industrialization yet we expect them to follow the western ways of moral behaviour and humanity yet not long before our industrialization we were marching the Indians on the "trail of tears'" and slavery was still around. I guess nobody is allowed to make our mistakes along the way to capitalist prosperity.

[robfromsc]

Originally Posted by twin-nut

If the crap really hit the fan with Iran, Israel could take care of the situation. A fission bomb has thee advantage of both huge blast effect and electromagnetic pulse and couldd leave enouggh radiation to prevent anyone from easily going back in that deep bunker. Although because the world community would raise holy hell, and rightfully so, it would take a serious perceived threat on the Israelis paart, but I am not sure they are willing to wait until Iran has a nuclear weapon completed. Obvious conjecture.

Is it not ironic that so much of the world is just beginning their industrialization yet we expect them to follow the western ways of moral behaviour and humanity yet not long before our industrialization we were marching the Indians on the "trail of tears'" and slavery was still around. I guess nobody is allowed to make our mistakes along the way to capitalist prosperity.

True, however nuclear weapons and blankets with pox are a little different.

When a regime has expressed the desire to wipe you from the map, it kinda leaves few options open. If your neighbor said he was going to burn your house to the ground and kill you family, then started mixing napalm in his garage....

[Area 51]

Good discussion for a change .
I don't feel any guilt over small pox. Colonists didn't have a clue they were carrying bugs. There was no way to stop that kind of disaster. It would have happened sooner or later. It's just the Indians bad luck.

Israel could conceivably take care of the situation with nukes but that is not a possibility, in my mind. They would never do that unless they were first hit with nukes themselves. They may be land-grabbing maggots but no human worth a dime would stoop to nuclear annialation unless it is retaliatory, IMO. Also, though Iran talks big I don't believe the bluster about wiping out Israel. Sure they want Israel to disolve and for the lands to be returned to the pre-1945 inhabitants. But they are not going to start a nuclear war over it. It is mostly self-serving propoganda. You know, most Iranians are not with the Mullahs. If they did a first strike against anyone, inluding Israel, I think it would be the end of the Mullahs. The Mullahs are not that stupid. But, personally, I think a lot of westerners ARE that stupid to buy into this crap about Iran nuking Israel (see the post above this one ). It ain't gonna happen unless a splinter group somehow sneeks a weapon into Israel. That must be the Mullahs worst nightmare...and the Israelis worst too.

[RockyMt]

CLINK!
(And with my man Ben running things in Israel, he's not going to, in his words "wait for the mushroom cloud before we act.....") Should keep the networks busy with the satelite coverage of "The Former Nation of Iran"!

-Rocky-

[Area 51]

The former Nation of Iran could become part of the new calaphate if Isreal nukes in anything but a retaliatory strike. That would so play into al Qaeda's hand it is not funny. You'd see governemts fall all around the former Iran, including ones that we get our oil from. Very, very dumb. Better we nuke Israel first so it does not happen, to tell you the truth.

[soslow]

Israel is a bigger threat to peace than Iran, so if we are going to attack anyone, shouldn't we attack Israel first?

[twin-nut]

Mutually assured destruction is an effective deterent according to history. Then again extremists did not control a nuclear arsennal so the situation is different. One difference is that many muslims as we have heard from protestors the last couple days in New York would like to wipe Israel from the map, whereas Israel is less extreme in there beliefs and although they could take any middle eastern nation down with their military, they are not of the mindset to do that. It is not of their belief system to bring "terror to the non-believers"

[soslow]

The zionist project of wiping Palestine off the map, which started more than 60 years ago, continues to this day. Palestine and the Palestinians are the ones in the Middle East who are actually being wiped off the map as I write this.

For all the rubbish about Iran wanting to wipe Israel off the map, even if that was true, they are not capable of doing it.

Israel is capable of wiping Palestine - and the Palestinians - off the map, is intent on doing so, and is actually doing it.

Don't be side-tracked from what is happening day after day in Palestine by the propaganda about the 'threat' from Iran.

[Gog]

Originally Posted by twin-nut

Mutually assured destruction is an effective deterent according to history. Then again extremists did not control a nuclear arsennal so the situation is different. One difference is that many muslims as we have heard from protestors the last couple days in New York would like to wipe Israel from the map, whereas Israel is less extreme in there beliefs and although they could take any middle eastern nation down with their military, they are not of the mindset to do that. It is not of their belief system to bring "terror to the non-believers"

You dont see a billion Muslims acting like these guys though. Same way you dont see a billion Christians acting like David Koresh. I'll bet Koresh was promoted when he got to heaven.. from priest to Friar.

[Area 51]

Originally Posted by soslow

The zionist project of wiping Palestine off the map, which started more than 60 years ago, continues to this day.

Bingo. Well put. It's unfortunate, isn't it? Our ally is a morally bankrupt trouble-maker. They picked a fight and they got it. I never, ever felt a bit of sympathy for a bully.