Front pads dragging

[markabus]

I was at the track last weekend and with my bike on the front stand discovered a ton of drag from the pads. The wheel will hardly turn 2 full revolutions. I took the calipers off the rotors and verified the wheel bearings were fine, took the OEM pads out and verified the pots were moving in and out of the calipers OK, then reassembled. After setting the pads they just don't seem to want to release from the rotors. Can someone let me know what kind of free spin they have on the front wheel and suggest what else to do. OEM master, Galfer lines, OEM calipers, OEM pads.

Thanks,

Markabus.

[RIRC51]

Have you tried searching yet? There's loads of threads on the subject.

[Doughnut Spaghetti]

Are they new pads? Sometime's I've had to redo the brake fluid when I get new pads. Not, saying it's the answer, but I've had that happen. You also have to let the pads "set" when they are new or properly brake them in. If you already know this, what ever, if not, I hope it helps.

When was the last time you changed your brake fluid and bleed the system?

Also, it might be time for some new piston seals.

Just my

[3stripes]

Two revolution might not be great but I'm in the same boat after some brake upgrades. This is after bleeding because I've swapped out the old calipers to 08 1000RR calipers. Seems so far because the caliper(left side) was not aligned to the rotors. I shimmed the caliper mount with a 4.5mm shim/washer and it got me to where I am now.

Under two full revolution of the front rim. These calipers were low milage due to the stock brake pads that came with them had tons of life. I also took the piston out and clean them with new brake fluids as well prior to install.

Everything seems to be working ok, except I don't quite trust them yet compared to the stock calipers.

[Plwtwo]

Yeah, I'm in about the same spin revolutions. After replacing master with Brembo, new fluid and new rotors, new "broke in" pads, stock wheels- almost 2 revolutions, with Marvic Mags 2 complete revolutions. I went thru it three times..everything is right but still thats all the spin I get.

[Southbound Pachyderm]

Originally Posted by Plwtwo

Yeah, I'm in about the same spin revolutions. After replacing master with Brembo, new fluid and new rotors, new "broke in" pads, stock wheels- almost 2 revolutions, with Marvic Mags 2 complete revolutions. I went thru it three times..everything is right but still thats all the spin I get.

Seems right to me Preston. I only have issues when I swap between wheels, since I have SP2 rotors on my Marvic and the stock front on my SP1. I just push the pads all the way in, then reset them. Quarter to half turn was all I was getting before I figured out that the different thickness rotors were binding.
How do you like the Brembo? What size? I love my 19x18!

[Vitza]

there's a special way to torque the front axle on... cant remember exactly but search it. just torquing it correctly i went from 1-2 revolutions to about 4-5... then rebuilt my calipers and the wheel spins 8+

[RVTMAVERICK]

Originally Posted by Vitza

there's a special way to torque the front axle on... cant remember exactly but search it. just torquing it correctly i went from 1-2 revolutions to about 4-5... then rebuilt my calipers and the wheel spins 8+

+1 with Vitza,... Except I'm not getting 8 rev.,.. BUT my rim is super lite, so, there's the reason why I'm not getting 8... 5+ for sure though!

Don't just blow off how the HONDA service manual informs you the "Right way" to tighten your axle pinch bolts, Toqure #s,... and the feeler gage HONDA supplies in the tool kit... IF You do everything as it says and AFTER you have your pads bedded in... You'll be spinn' well more then 2 rev. I'm sure. Unless something else is wrong...?

Peace Jeff

[Plwtwo]

Brembo Master is the bomb!! (RCS19x18)

I'm not even using the full factory torque amounts, All titanium front end bolts, axle, pinch bolts, caliper mounting bolts, and Marvic Mag wheels. So I know I dont have a over tight situation...But I will again. I actually never noticed this before I switched to the Marvics and BrakeTec Rotors.

[Trace]

I had this same problem of pad drag, getting maybe 2 turns before the front wheel stopped. I monkeyed around for a month with bleeding and various axle/fork tightening scenarios and whatnot. Waste of time.

After reading plenty of threads here, I ordered new piston seals (and caliper body seals and dust boots). Now my front wheel has almost no drag at all. Spins for maybe 30 seconds, stopping from bearing drag, not brakes.

The square cross-section design of the piston seal is what pulls the piston (and the pads) back into the cylinder after actuation. [this is true for all disc brakes, BTW]. After a few years of hellish heat, those seals tend to take a diamond shape AND lose their elasticity such that they don't pull the pistons back anymore. And then the pads drag and make even MORE heat for those seals. You can disassemble and clean the calipers to your heart's content, but it won't do much good for long. New seals is the answer.

Seriously......I just went out to my garage and gave my front a spin. 30+ seconds, more than a dozen turns (I quit counting). Comes to a sloooow stop. Before my seal work, it was practially locke up! And I did that work 18 months ago...still perfect.

All new rubber in your calipers is the dealio!!

[DRFLGD]

How many miles on your bike when you replaced the seals?

[Trace]

Originally Posted by DRFLGD

How many miles on your bike when you replaced the seals?

In March 2008 (figure 8 years of use) and about 13K miles. But, I got the bike in May 2007 and the calipers should have rebuilt before that point. It just took me a while to discover the brake drag issue and figure it out!

I recall that during the beginning of common disc brake use on Detroit cars (around 1971 or so, on the front brakes only--rears mostly stayed drum for another 20 years) the pistons froze and the rotors locked up on many cars, sometimes causing bearing grease fires due to the glowing rotor heat! It was the seals, of course. Fortunately, that sort of thing is exceedingly rare these days. I guess they finally got the design and materials right!

[Southbound Pachyderm]

Originally Posted by Plwtwo

Brembo Master is the bomb!! (RCS19x18)

I'm not even using the full factory torque amounts, All titanium front end bolts, axle, pinch bolts, caliper mounting bolts, and Marvic Mag wheels. So I know I dont have a over tight situation...But I will again. I actually never noticed this before I switched to the Marvics and BrakeTec Rotors.

No wonder you were so much faster than me at Road Atl!

[Southbound Pachyderm]

Originally Posted by Trace

I had this same problem of pad drag, getting maybe 2 turns before the front wheel stopped. I monkeyed around for a month with bleeding and various axle/fork tightening scenarios and whatnot. Waste of time.

After reading plenty of threads here, I ordered new piston seals (and caliper body seals and dust boots). Now my front wheel has almost no drag at all. Spins for maybe 30 seconds, stopping from bearing drag, not brakes.

The square cross-sectoin design of the piston seal is what pulls the piston (and the pads) back into the cylinder after actuation. [this is true for all disc brakes, BTW]. After a few years of hellish heat, those seals tend to take a diamond shape AND lose their elasticity such that they don't pull the pistons back anymore. And then the pads drag and make even MORE heat for those seals. You can disassemble and clean the calipers to your heart's content, but it won't do much good for long. New seals is the answer.

Seriously......I just went out to my garage and gave my front a spin. 30+ seconds, more than a dozen turns (I quit counting). Comes to a sloooow stop. Before my seal work, it was practially locke up! And I did that work 18 months ago...still perfect.

All new rubber in your calipers is the dealio!!

Shoot, I never would have thought of that. I just make sure the pistons are smooth and the seals are clean and pliable...
I know that mine retract, not nearly to the extent of yours though...

[mrgrn]

this was a fad back in end of 2000 into 2001. there was rogue'ers spending huge time with spacers and obsessing about the revs. the fact remains the slight drag might keep the pads warm enough to help make them have great initail bite and one of the reasons the RC561 has some of the best OEM brakes i have ever ridden

don't worry about the revs of the wheel. FWIW my R1 wheels spins much more freely and so did my CBR and they both had much worse initail bite and i felt less total braking then my 51

[Vitza]

Originally Posted by mrgrn

this was a fad back in end of 2000 into 2001. there was rogue'ers spending huge time with spacers and obsessing about the revs. the fact remains the slight drag might keep the pads warm enough to help make them have great initail bite and one of the reasons the RC561 has some of the best OEM brakes i have ever ridden

don't worry about the revs of the wheel. FWIW my R1 wheels spins much more freely and so did my CBR and they both had much worse initail bite and i felt less total braking then my 51

its not a fad and brake drag is NOT one of the reasons the rc's have great brakes, thats just ridiculous. also, the brake drag causes premature pad wear.

[mrgrn]

Originally Posted by Vitza

its not a fad and brake drag is NOT one of the reasons the rc's have great brakes, thats just ridiculous. also, the brake drag causes premature pad wear.

i have not heard one 1 issue in 10 years of premature pad wear, please show me this issue or links to it.

this was hashed to death years b4 most of the current owners were old enough to have a license

go on rogue and do a search from a decade ago, it was covered and people spent countless hours trying to get 5 spins and even those that did accomplished nothing in the end other then getting 5 spins once til they went for a ride.

the bike is fine and there is no issue with the 51's brakes stop wasting time over semantical stuff and ride

[Vitza]

Originally Posted by mrgrn

i have not heard one 1 issue in 10 years of premature pad wear, please show me this issue or links to it.

this was hashed to death years b4 most of the current owners were old enough to have a license

go on rogue and do a search from a decade ago, it was covered and people spent countless hours trying to get 5 spins and even those that did accomplished nothing in the end other then getting 5 spins once til they went for a ride.

the bike is fine and there is no issue with the 51's brakes stop wasting time over semantical stuff and ride

stop wasting time over semantical stuff and ride? you ****ing kidding me? why dont you stop pretending you know shit and go educate yourself. this is a forum where people ask questions, you giving the wrong answers is wasting time. me correcting your ignorant ass is NOT wasting time. kepeesh?

you want evidence and proof? how about you use your brain. i dont need to dig up articles and posts. if you have any logic then you wont have to rely on what OTHER PEOPLE have done / say. brakes dragging on the disc causes the pad to wear, rub two materials over eachother and over time the softer one will wear off. there's no difference w/ brakes. brake drag causes wear. period.

and by the way, i was ASE certified and worked at a shop a good amount of time. what i say comes from experience. you really need to stop pretending to be a know it all because you've read something someone wrote somewhere.

anyways, im not going to reply to you anymore regarding this subject because like in all your previous posts where someone tells you you're wrong, you regress into a 5year old. i've stayed out of all of them and kept my mouth shut but to be honest, you really need to change your ways.

ill stop wasting your time and go ride now

[mrgrn]

Originally Posted by Vitza

stop wasting time over semantical stuff and ride? you ****ing kidding me? why dont you stop pretending you know shit and go educate yourself. this is a forum where people ask questions, you giving the wrong answers is wasting time. me correcting your ignorant ass is NOT wasting time. kepeesh?

you want evidence and proof? how about you use your brain. i dont need to dig up articles and posts. if you have any logic then you wont have to rely on what OTHER PEOPLE have done / say. brakes dragging on the disc causes the pad to wear, rub two materials over eachother and over time the softer one will wear off. there's no difference w/ brakes. brake drag causes wear. period.

and by the way, i was ASE certified and worked at a shop a good amount of time. what i say comes from experience. you really need to stop pretending to be a know it all because you've read something someone wrote somewhere.

anyways, im not going to reply to you anymore regarding this subject because like in all your previous posts where someone tells you you're wrong, you regress into a 5year old. i've stayed out of all of them and kept my mouth shut but to be honest, you really need to change your ways.

ill stop wasting your time and go ride now

like i said. i have had a 51 for almost 11 years now and i have yet to hear of one issue of premature pad wear. i happen to like some heat on my pads and rotors they tend to stop better

not saying that a serious problem can not occur but spending time to get extra spins was done years ago and it was found they are fine enough and people have been using them as is for over a decade with no pad wear issue. If you have some facts or links to these issues i would love to see them but you can keep your silly ranty type tude

[mrgrn]

Originally Posted by Vitza

there's a special way to torque the front axle on... cant remember exactly but search it.

this is great stuff here