Air scoops and fans

[RVTMAVERICK]

Originally Posted by borislav

SPAL pusher fan is the best and cheapest way to go!

Well,... everyone has a right to their Opinion, right or Wrong...
However, fact of the matter IS, a $6.00 DPDTCenter OFF switch, IS By far the Cheapest way to go... AND IMHO The BEST

As dadrc51, said "...i can see nobody listens...as usual ...the info is their for a cheap fix."

As such.. this topic for the RC51 about... HELP: I've got a Hot Running RC51! Or Cooling System Sucks or, or, or, the list goes on an on,.. is old as shit! So I usually blow these threads off... BUT when someone says Cheapest and Best mod., You kind of got to pay attention LOL... So... Here I am again in one of these OLD News RC51 Runs HOT topic(s) LOL To tell You ALL.. a $6 switch IS Cheaper then a $30 SPAL pusher fan

I don't have a "Set of Scoops" and FWIW and or For ALL Your info., while I love the look of the radi. fins, on MY RC51, they do NOTHING but help My RC51 run hotter!... They do SHIT for cooling Period! I even install my radi. fins, late Fall until early Spring to aid in warming up my RC51s cooling system.
All's I am running is the switch which I installed years ago, where I can run my fans in both directions and SHUT them OFF... Since said install, I my temps. have NOT gone over 221 to 222 degs. Period!

Anyway,.. Enjoy trying your mods., it is all part of getting to know your RC51s, which is the best thing of all!


OH Yeah, for the couple of guys that have had ZERO problems with your RC51s running HOT!..?. #1) Thank GOD... and #2) I bet you IF you had your RC51s here in the summer,.. I could get your temps. to 230++ degs. while riding... No Problem!

[tondar]

There is absolutely no reason to run the stock fans with reversed polarity. It's absolutely pointless, it blows some air sideways but that's about it. I wouldn't know this if I hadn't ignored the "experts" of the board and conducted my own testing.

I have no interest in flipping a switch around while I'm riding. The Spal can be attached to one rad and even has the same connector so no reason to cut or splice anything. Since it's pushing air in the same direction as the natural flow through the bike you don't have to bother with switches.

You'll lose a couple pounds to boot!!

[DesperateSP2]

OK, as soon as the Honda dealer and the local auto part shop open after the usual never ending summer break let's see who has the best price on parts...

[ZeroGara]

From looking at dyno charts and air/fuel ratios, the mixture is way too lean on stock mapping and all maps I have seen enrich the low rpm (below 3500rpm) significantly. This makes idling and low rpm rolling to create more heat. The drawback on this is that with a richer mixture the engine tends to lower rpm faster when off throttle which you may have to adjust your riding to.
Bleeping the throttle and raising the rpm a bit may help, as it makes the mixture a bit rich and helps coolant circulation. In this respect if gearing would make any difference when riding slow yours should be better than stock. RPM alone does not increase heat unless there is a load on the engine. In most cases as cooling systems are optimized for higher rpm than idle it helps cooling. It is just bad for the engine's bottom end to be reving it high with no load on the bearings.
I don't know much about the SPAL fan, but to me it seems as the frontal area of it seems greater, thus reducing flow through the fan. It may be flowing much more air when running, but if it reduces air flow when it is not then it will have to run more. Fan rolling resistance is also related to this, how easy is it for the fan to roll and allow air through it when not running. Brushless motors with good bearings and low inertia are able to have less resistance than others. Aerodynamics of pulling fans and pushing fans are important as well when reversing fans but I doubt that either one of them is so well designed.
I think I'll stick with my Honda reversed fans and switch.
SUMCO hoses also help cooling by reducing the Y connection resistance and are lighter with a few less clamps on them. I think I'll get a set before my next tearing apart tune-up like valve adjustment.

Originally Posted by b.miller123

FWIW, I have a switch set up to turn on the stock fans, whenever I want and it works pretty good, up until it's about 95-100 degrees outside. Then it starts getting a little scary when it never drops below 205 on the freeway (15/40 with no pc and slip-ons), then immediately starts going up unless the fans are running 100% of the time while below 40-50mph. I'm thinking scoops, returning to 16/40, ditching the stock fans for one spal, and adding a powercommander will fix it just fine.

[MyRCRocks]

Is the Spal fan a direct bolt on application?

[selfinfliction]

Originally Posted by RVTMAVERICK

Well,... everyone has a right to their Opinion, right or Wrong...
However, fact of the matter IS, a $6.00 DPDTCenter OFF switch, IS By far the Cheapest way to go... AND IMHO The BEST

As dadrc51, said "...i can see nobody listens...as usual ...the info is their for a cheap fix."

As such.. this topic for the RC51 about... HELP: I've got a Hot Running RC51! Or Cooling System Sucks or, or, or, the list goes on an on,.. is old as shit! So I usually blow these threads off... BUT when someone says Cheapest and Best mod., You kind of got to pay attention LOL... So... Here I am again in one of these OLD News RC51 Runs HOT topic(s) LOL To tell You ALL.. a $6 switch IS Cheaper then a $30 SPAL pusher fan

the fans on the rc suck, it doesn't matter if you have them sucking air from dried ice on 16 toggle switches and running on nitrous. spend a few bucks on the spal fan and you won't have extra wires and switches and have to do anything. the computer run the fans as normal.

as far as i know me and borislav are the only two people that have actually put the spal fan on there, to knock it without consideration of what is being told by the people who have done it, isn't smart.

Originally Posted by MyRCRocks

Is the Spal fan a direct bolt on application?

you need the mounting strips or whatever to hold it on the radiator, then you can snip the connectors off the oem fan and splice them onto the spal and it plugs right up, nothing else needed.

[RVTMAVERICK]

tondar & selfinfliction<


I have NEVER said I was an expert of any kind and talk about NOT Smart..?

People have asked for help.. This is what works for ME and Others.. I don't mind flipping a switch.. I actually think it's cool because I Like being Involved in My machine! So what is pointless is the guys that say something doesn't work.... When Helloooo... It works Great IF You know what the hell you're doing!?... The word "Cheapest" came up as well and FWIW, You can't beat 6 bucks, with 30., NO Way, NO How.. That's IT.

FYI and I know at this point, it is worth nothing. .. BUT How I use MY OEM Fans with my $6 DTDP Center OFF Switch,... I could just about bet you, My Temps. come down Just as fast, if not Faster, then Yours does with your special fan(s) Also FWIW., Nothing again I know,.. but reversing the OEM fan(s) while I'm doing 40+mph and up... does shit for pushing the air sideways... MY Temps. drop from 219 to 220 to under 200degs.. in LESS then 3min.!!! So IF the OEM fans suck so bad,... maybe it is something Wrong with your Fan(s)... ever think of that?

As I have said before, My computer Still runs the Fans.. I just tell them which way to go and OFF, as off at certian times is Better then them running in the OEM direction, when you're doing 40pmh and over!!!

Lastly, I wish you guys nothing but the best... I would love to hear everyone has a great time with their RC51s and NO Problems.. However when I get PMs asking for help, this IS My Tip... Because is works friggin' Great for me!... Why in the world would I go buy a aftermarket fan?

Good luck to all of you and Enjoy Rides!

[ZeroGara]

Originally Posted by tondar

There is absolutely no reason to run the stock fans with reversed polarity. It's absolutely pointless, it blows some air sideways but that's about it. I wouldn't know this if I hadn't ignored the "experts" of the board and conducted my own testing.

Interesting! How did you do the testing and what were your results? I did some myself and wonder whether we came to the same conclusions. The questions that remained was why di Honda have those fans run inwards?

[tondar]

RVTMAVERICK,

I "know what I'm doing" because I took the time to take the stock fans off and experiment with them. Anybody who takes the stock fans off and holds them in their hands while hooking up leads to a battery will tell you the same thing. With stock polarity they move a good amount of air. Switching the polarity turns them into amp drawing noise makers! Now if you flip polarity AND flip the blade around they will perform as you think their performing for you now.

The reason flipping polarity at higher speeds works better than stock polarity is because the fan is no longer fighting the natural air flow through the bike. What would work even better?! TURN THE FAN OFF COMPLETELY!! it may not cool any faster but it wouldn't be drawing current.

Oh and my single SPAL pulls my temps from 219 to 209 in 45 seconds sitting still (i.e. working on one rad only, when I'm moving and have air flowing through the unobstructed other side it's even faster).

So why buy the SPAL? cools better, saves weight, and NO WIRING MODS REQUIRED AT ALL!!!. I don't know what SelfInfliction is talking about, the connector on my Spal hooked right up to the stock wiring harness. No cutting/splicing required.

One note for those who read this and decide to buy the Spal. You must mount the spal flush against the inside of the radiator, don't leave a gap between it and the rad. It's very easy to do..

[JBs_SP3]

Originally Posted by ZeroGara

The questions that remained was why di Honda have those fans run inwards?

I've asked myself that question ... maybe there's a regulation somewhere in the world about not blowing hot air out sideways from a vehicle? Or perhaps they just thought it was not "Honda" to have their then state-of-the-art Superbike spewing hot air out ... or perhaps they just f**ked up?

[ZeroGara]

Originally Posted by tondar

I "know what I'm doing" because I took the time to take the stock fans off and experiment with them..... Switching the polarity turns them into amp drawing noise makers! Now if you flip polarity AND flip the blade around they will perform as you think their performing for you now.

The reason flipping polarity at higher speeds works better than stock polarity is because the fan is no longer fighting the natural air flow through the bike. ....

This is probably because there is a spring between the fan, shaft, and motor which allows some play on it without loading the motors bearings. Good point, as the pressure is on the opposite side eventually something will wear out (drag/noise) and break. But hopefully those fans don't run anywhere long enough to do so.

Originally Posted by JBs_SP3

I've asked myself that question ... maybe there's a regulation somewhere in the world about not blowing hot air out sideways from a vehicle? Or perhaps they just thought it was not "Honda" to have their then state-of-the-art Superbike spewing hot air out ... or perhaps they just f**ked up?

I doubt they fυcked up intentionally in both the RC and the VFR which they produced for the longest time like this. I don;t know if the VTR1oooF is the same too. I presume that in narrow minded Honda way the bike is either stopped or moving at a good pace. Real world traffic though, especially in states and countries where splitting lanes is either legal or tolerated, moving between cars' mirrors at over 15-20mph is if not risky anti-social! This is where we need the fix. But even when you are occupying a lane in slow traffic the problem is the same.
My testing was done by taping fine light thread (teltails) around the rad opening of the fairing and watch them from 0-25mph. As soon as there was enough air moving to move them they moved out and back, which means if the fans were running they were running against flow. I actually got to look at them while the fans did come on and even standing still they moved so little that you had to stick them up against the screen to realize there was inwards flow.
In an other thread and forum I had read claims that raising the forks past the first line (or more than 8mm-3/8") reduces flow significantly to where bikes overheat at track speeds. This is where those airscoops help.

Anyway, I think if Honda didn;t have that digital temp. readout and just had an analog 5bar readout or a needle gauge we wouldn't be so paranoid
I guess in those black-red needle gauges the red must be around 245'F

Tondar has made me think of a project now. Take the stock fan out and mold a reverse pitch propeler out of carbon. I doubt that would cost any less than a SPAL, but at least I will not have that huge bulk of a motor in the way of the flow.

[selfinfliction]

Originally Posted by RVTMAVERICK

MY Temps. drop from 219 to 220 to under 200degs.. in LESS then 3min.!!! So IF the OEM fans suck so bad,... maybe it is something Wrong with your Fan(s)... ever think of that?

sorry if i came off as abrasive before, i'm just an ass

with the spal if you're moving, cooling that much would be measured in seconds, not minutes. that's because a single spal moves more air than both of the stockers flowing in any direction

Originally Posted by tondar

I don't know what SelfInfliction is talking about, the connector on my Spal hooked right up to the stock wiring harness. No cutting/splicing required.

could be different models of fans, or they may have changed the connectors over time or something. Mine came with the circle plugs so i cut them off and used the paddle adapters

[DesperateSP2]

When ordering the SPAL fan you should make sure it's the VA31-A101-46S type (part number 3010-3013).
It comes with the standard Sumitomo connector used on Japanese bikes.
Hope this helped you guys out!

[RVTMAVERICK]

Well Awesome Guys... IF Your temps. Really come down that fast... You've done good then right...
Good job\find


BUT Still: "Cheapest mod." IMO => DPDT Center OFF switch and it works Great for ME!...
Best mod. Sounds like you gays just might be on to something, eh...?

Also boys, Had I not already FIX'd, My Old High Temp. problems along time ago... I will NOT Lie.. I would Definitely be looking into your fan mod., no doubt.

By the way.. WHO was it that came up with said "SPAL fan" info.?

Peace Jeff

[JBs_SP3]

Originally Posted by RVTMAVERICK

WHO was it that came up with said "SPAL fan" info.?

I think Self Infliction blazed the trail there.

[selfinfliction]

yeah was me, I run SPAL's on all the drag cars we build because of the volume they move, without requiring any major amp draws. we've put them on the radiator, on the ice boxes, oil coolers, tranny coolers, air-to-water heat exchangers for the intercoolers... anything that requires a fan gets a SPAL.

[ZeroGara]

I think I'm going to get one for my desk since they push so well

Why do you have ice boxes on a drag car? Freezing fuel?
Would dry ice work on a drag intercooler?

Originally Posted by selfinfliction

yeah was me, I run SPAL's on all the drag cars we build because of the volume they move, without requiring any major amp draws. we've put them on the radiator, on the ice boxes, oil coolers, tranny coolers, air-to-water heat exchangers for the intercoolers... anything that requires a fan gets a SPAL.

[selfinfliction]

Originally Posted by ZeroGara

I think I'm going to get one for my desk since they push so well

Why do you have ice boxes on a drag car? Freezing fuel?
Would dry ice work on a drag intercooler?

ice boxes are necessary when you run air to water intercoolers and have somewhere between 1500-2000whp. not sure really since the dyno tops out at 1500





the intercooler sits inside underneath the dash and the icebox/heat exchanger is behind the passenger's seat



for comparison, this is the turbo sitting on top of my supercharged cobalt , you can see it's about 1/2 the size of the entire engine

[RVTMAVERICK]

LMAO! WHOLEY SHITE Mang.! Nuff said

[Ika-kun]

Originally Posted by DesperateSP2

When ordering the SPAL fan you should make sure it's the VA31-A101-46S type (part number 3010-3013).
It comes with the standard Sumitomo connector used on Japanese bikes.
Hope this helped you guys out!

I've looked everywhere for this exact fan and it seems they're backordered. Where can I get one in the US, now, for cheap?