swing arm removal,

how come ducati service manual says to remove engine to remove swing arm but desmo times does not??

Maybe Desmo Times forgot? Or it depends on your point view. I remove the frame and swing arm from the engine so from my point of view Desmo Times is right and Ducati is wrong. The point is the steel bushings that run through the swingarm bearings can't be pulled out of the frame boss if the engine is still between the swingarm bushings.

thats what i was thinking,

You don't have to remove the engine, but you have to at least loosen the engine mount bolts so you can pry the swingarm off with some sort of prying tool like a crowbar or a big screwdriver (a brutal procedure). It's easier and cleaner to loosen the front bolt, remove the rear bolt, and pivot the engine down. But you definitely don't need to remove the engine completely.

Totally aggree with Jeff, you would need a pry bar to pull out the swingarm.
The engine does not need to be remove.

My pry bars