999 motor/swingarm in a monster (s4) frame. observations so far.

as some of you may recall, i'm stuffing a 999 sourced motor and swingarm into my monster s4 frame this winter. i've got the frame dropped on the motor and have made some observations i figured were worth sharing. first, here's the specimen:


1 - motor mounts are just fine. mounting bolts are same width, frame location is identical as expected and cases are same width as well.

2 - there's no way the 999's airbox is fitting. the bar that runs from the lower left frame rail to the lower right frame rail right behind the steering head conflicts. i'm debating either making a new airbox to suit the dimmensions or cutting the bar and welding in an "x" bar that would offer a bit more clearance for the airbox lid. in either case... i'm going to try to make a CF box since it's such a visible item on a naked bike.

3 - with the 999's swingarm, the mounting orientation for the tie rod and shock are about 25mm's over to the LEFT compared to the monster's so they don't jive with the stock rocker-mount location. i pinged alex ortner to bounce the idea of making a custom rocker to accomodate but with his advice, i came to the conclusion that modifying the frame to move the rocker mount point makes more sense and will cost much less (next to nothing).

4 - thankfully, i recieved the longer 999 suspension tie rod for the rear because the stock monster one doesn't seem to be quite long enough. but i'll know for sure when the bike's together and the rear suspension's under a load. i've still got the s4's stock unit as well as the unit off a 998 which is the shortest just in case.

5 - radiator mounts are almost in perfect position. the tabs on the radiator will have to be bent outward SLIGHTLY to be able to use the stock s4 mounting on the frame.

6 - fuel tank mount has to be jacked up about 1/2" for the tank to clear the vertical cylinder. thankfully i hadn't sold my tank yet so i could check this clearance. hopefully, the CF tank will be either identical or will offer a bit more room. will see if/when DNA finally delivers one!

7 - haven't quite decided yet where to put the battery and regulator. i may source a teenie battery to hide under the tank and the regulator may go under the tail as before but there's going to be some other (secret sneaky) stuff conflicting under there

8 - oh yeah... very SLIGHT conflict on the "X-bar" that goes across the frame by the throttle bodies with the fast-idle cam on the 999 assembly. not sure if i'm going to rework the cam or cut a small section out of the bar. will likely rework the bar.

9 - last really important thing is that the frame will have to have a brace added to help support the load of the swingarm at the pivot since the 999 motor's got less meat/support back there.

i'll post more as things develop!

Strati-
1. Looks Great!
2. Could you put the regulator above the radiator (tucked inward toward engine)?
3. Did you ever give any thought to a SSS? What would it take to do vs. the 999 swingarm?

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by foggy123 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Strati-
1. Looks Great!
2. Could you put the regulator above the radiator (tucked inward toward engine)?
3. Did you ever give any thought to a SSS? What would it take to do vs. the 999 swingarm? </TD></TR></TABLE>

I was putting my regulator at the left sida above the radiator using the same attachment as the radiator. The main reason was that I installed an alarm there the regulator is located normaly. It does not look so good but it is at least properly cooled.

Jocke..........

Outstanding strati, so apart from those few minor changes she is completely bulk standard

Very cool work, if we tried that in NZ we would have to verify, certfiy...........teh fun police would have us on a stick!

Lookin forward to more pics.

Strati, you are always working outside of the box. The crazy part is your S4 looked great before! (I always look forward to reading your posts.) Thanks again for all of the help with my suspension. My bike now feels the way it should have always felt...planted to the road.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by foggy123 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Strati-
1. Looks Great!
2. Could you put the regulator above the radiator (tucked inward toward engine)?
3. Did you ever give any thought to a SSS? What would it take to do vs. the 999 swingarm? </TD></TR></TABLE>
thanks! i think the regulator could find it's way just forward of the airbox. it'll get decent airflow there to keep relatively cool. just have to get to modelling the airbox so i can see exactly how much room i'll have. i was thinking of putting it under the rear cowl i'm going to make and putting the battery way up front instead. it's going to mainly depend on how the 998 wiring harness lines up. i think with the 998 wiring harness, the regulator's connections are very close to the battery itself (visualizing a SBK without the bodywork) so i may need to find room for BOTH up there.

as for the single sided swingarm. as much as i think it suits the SBK's, i don't really like it on a monster. despite the common oppinion, i don't really like even the unit on the s4R. the swingarm itself looks great, but i don't like it on the monster. this is fortunate for me because to use a 916-type SSS, i'd have to source a really short tie-rod and shock to avoid having the rear end REALLY jacked up high. this is because of how the tie rod and shock mount to tabs that jut above the top surface of the SSS versus how the tie rod and shock mount IN the 999 swingarm, just as on the monster unit.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Monstaman &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Outstanding strati, so apart from those few minor changes she is completely bulk standard
</TD></TR></TABLE>
you know what's funny? it just occurred to me the other day that the only actual stock items that will be on the bike when this is all said and done will be the frame and the main portion of the headlamp. all other bodywork, instrumentation, wiring, motor, chassis... aftermarket, one-off, or out of a 999 or 998. but at least it's still registerred as a monster s4

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by s4strati &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
at least it's still registerred as a monster s4
</TD></TR></TABLE>

And thus you are still eligible to win that S4R in the Ducati Monster Challenge. I am tempted to sacrifice a perfect running Ducati Monster for a VIN/Registration for a customers 998-based custom cruiser underway now. Having to kill/destroy (and then part out) a perfect Ducati Monster to meet the guideline of the rules is a waste... but if that is what is required...

yep. will be able to enter it. i don't think i'd do it for the sake of the monster challenge (as cool as it would be to participate if you're not able already), but this is the direction i was going with for the s4 anyways. the challenge being up this winter is a lucky coincidence to be able to participate. that, and my wife's excited to go to long island and look for a diamond pendant (though i don't know who's footing THAT bill )

Strati'

I put a SSS on my 999. Encountered the ride height problem but worked it out by using a rod that was meant to lower the monster. The 999 swingarm is slightly longer than the SSS (I had to use the longer magnesium one). Not sure of the length in relation to the stock monster swingarm. I've got a bunch of stock parts from the 999 swingarm if you need anything. It looks so good I'm starting to look at my monster in a funny way...

This is very interesting, is there anything new to report?

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Dave B. &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Strati'
It looks so good I'm starting to look at my monster in a funny way...</TD></TR></TABLE>

addictive isn't it?! honestly, i'm not too big a fan of a SSS on monsters, but it sure makes for a cool project. interesting that with just a shorter tie rod, you could work out the SSS on the 999. i figured the longer shock-length would also come into play which is why for the monster, i'm using an ohlins off a 998 rather than a 999 version. it's a bit shorter.

as for updates, nothing major. just working out the rocker location to align with the swingarm better. some frame hacking has been done too. removed the "x" bars from the throttle body location and will weld in a different strut for easier clearance. i've got a bunch of wire mesh and clay to start modelling the parts i'm going to fab from CF and i've gotta order the CF to start building when the molds are done. i've got the week following thanksgiving off so i'm planning on getting a lot accomplished then:

Strati-
What are you going to run for exhaust?

What do you have for old parts that you would be willing to part with? BTW bike is looking like it's going to be wicked.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by foggy123 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Strati-
What are you going to run for exhaust?</TD></TR></TABLE>
i've got a set of OEM 998 headers as well as a couple sets of 999 headers. wouldn't you know it that nothing quite fits? i'm sorta up in the air about what to do. i can hack/rebend/reweld some lengths off the 998 unit to fit but want to go bigger than 45mm's. i'm interpretting some info brad has posted on moto-one's site that 52mm's is really the way to go for a testastretta motor (http://www.moto-one.com.au/performan...comp54_57.html). so what i think it's going to come down to is time/money. if i have enough of both, i'm going to use the header flanges off the 998 system (for the convenience of not making new ones) and the rest of the entire system i'm going to make myself. thoughts in my head are of a system with equal length headers for each cylinder, merging into a single large tube for a 3-4" length "cross-over", exitting to two streamlined mufflers shooting upwards at an angle that matches the frame spars. if this comes to be, i think it'll be pretty cool.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ducdude &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">What do you have for old parts that you would be willing to part with? BTW bike is looking like it's going to be wicked.</TD></TR></TABLE>

sorry but almost everything i had on my bike that is not being put to use has been sold. motor's gone. stock wheels are gone. stock rotors are gone. swingarm's gone, etc...
i've got a small handful of stuff still kicking around as well as "extra" SBK parts that may or may not be used that i'm going to pool together for a "yard sale" when the bike's done and i'm sure i no longer need 'em. one thing i have for sure is my s4's tank. you can see it here: http://www.ducatipipemod.com/forsale (carbon fiber one's on order and will hopefully arrive by the end of '04!)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by foggy123 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Strati-
What are you going to run for exhaust?</TD></TR></TABLE>

Ooooops...how did that happen ...I didn't mean to post this

not quite like that (curse you andi!!!)... hehehe.

ok off topic, but where is the battery etc for the NCR bike? Is it under the tank like the monster?

And Strati - you said you had clay and wire mesh to make molds of parts, what kind of clay, as you my not know (which I'm sure you don't) I am a potter in my spare time so I've got an excess of clay. But it is all high fire, so I'm curious what you are using as the clay I have shrinks 7-13% during the drying process.

I've been wanting to make some parts out of fiber glass/ carbon for some time, but wasn't sure how to go about it.